Or, alternately, Carnival may revamp it's commission program entirely and decide to pay their sales streams what they are worth. People who advise and consult a client and service the sale would receive a commission. People who refer clients to a website and try to sell certificates woudl also earn their worth--a finder's fee. Maybe $25?
But in either scenario, YTB and the other MLMs are probably not in the best spot!
Ok, here's the scoop! Maybe you can understand this and why RTA's don't get paid a "finder's fee".
ReplyDeleteIf YTB's RTA's got paid a "finder's fee", then Travelocity, Orbitz, Expedia, etc should also receive a "finder's fee".
They don't, so we don't!
The vendors don't pay the RTA's a commission directly. Let's get that straight!
Just like the vendors pay Travelocity a commission to advertise, they pay YTB a commission to do what they want with. YTB decided that instead of paying for advertisement, YTB would give their RTAs more than half of the commissions paid to YTB!
Also, by taking serving my clients beyond just telling them to click and order and actually getting hands on with their booking, I earn every single commission that I make!
I bet this is another in a long line of "misunderstandings". Or another, who cares we didn't like her kind of things. I find this WAY interesting. Or maybe just maybe Carnivals new CEO didn't approve of her supporting MLMs/Card Mills. Things are going to get interesting to say the least!!
ReplyDeleteProud - why do you act like YTB is doing anything "special" by giving you 60% of the commission. They are not being generous at all - they are offering a very substandard commission split - and the fact that they do no advertising just makes you the sucker who gets stuck paying for all customer acquisition.
ReplyDeleteWell Proud, I think you may be witnessing a fundamental change in the way agents and "referrers" are paid.
ReplyDeleteMy point is that the vast majority of the MLM crowd is in it for the perks and do not produce. Of the ones that DO produce, most simply direct people to the website. The VERY few that actually service a sale are the minority.
So why does Carnival pay top commission for that? Gerry and Reuben are money men, we are in a recession, and to be honest, YTB and the like has polluted this industry. I am not saying you will be the cause of a net environment when it comes, but you will definitely be an accelerant of it!
Your people (for the most part) are inept and rely on technology or a third party (vendor) to convey a sale. This was evidenced on your big cruise sale. I know of several people that called and no one experienced any YTB person that would be able to affect a sale. Hell, one of the YTB reps insisted that they had sailings from Phoenix!
So, when a supplier sees how little you really do care for the industry and product, and how much you care for the top tier commission and the perks and discounts---what are they to think? Cut them out!
You are not setting me straight on how compensation works in the INDUSTRY. I know all about hosts and independent contractors and how they work. Remember, I built my business from the ground up---I did not buy an Agency In A Box for $449 and $50 a month.
I don't dispute your claims about client service--for all I know you may actually be telling the truth, but the FACT is that most RTAs do not!
A sale is a sale. I don't think the vendors care "where" it comes from.
ReplyDeleteRCCL will soon reverse their decision and reinstate YTB I would imagine now the VF is on board . . .
Plus - if vendors do go this route - ytb will just circumvent the process and run the deals through 3rd parties.
You aren't giving ytb enough credit johnny boy. YTB has already weathered the supposed storm of rccl, iata and those other minute almost non-existent vendors - like perillo and such . . .
Look for '08 to be GREAT . . .
Tom
Hrmm and here I thought Scott said he would never take RCCL back *puffy lip and all*. Tom must have some more "insider" information that will turn out to be false.
ReplyDeleteOr is this coming from the bereau of misinformation again?
Considering Adam Goldstein's recent SUPPORT of the decision to dump YTB, et al I seriously doubt VF was brought aboard to reverse the decision.
ReplyDeleteCan we put a little money on this??
ReplyDeleteI don't think that RCI will suddenly take YTB back just because of the staff changes. That doesn't make any sense. I do think it will be interesting to see what changes she does make though.
RCI put out a memo on what they believed constituted a card mill and unless YTB has made some drastic changes I doubt they will take them back any time soon.
Did any suppliers come forward and defend YTB when the others dropped them?
One could also argue the flip side - that Carnival was not happy with the stance Vicki took in support of the YTB and that's why she is no longer there. Gives them an easy way to reverse that position!
ReplyDeleteHey Anonymous, Vicki wasn't fired from Carnival. She resigned on her own.
ReplyDeleteNow as to why she resigned, we won't truely know until we hear it from Vicki herself. She knows the reasons. We don't. Until this point comes, any further talk of it is just speculation, and because it is... I am not concerned.
People leave one company to work for another all the time. Why should this be any different?
Ths isn't a YTB issue. It's a CCL/RCCL/Vicki issue.
Hi guys. I heven't posted here much, but have been reading along and watching as things unfold. There's one thing I have noticed that really shouldn't happen. I norticed that a lot of travel agents are badmouthing Carnival Cruiselines. I find this quite unprofessional and wonder what Carnival would think about this.
ReplyDeleteWhen someone comes to you to set up a cruise on Carnival, do you recommend another cruiseline to them because you don't like Carnival personally?
Proud--since you are apparently in tight with Vicki, please give her a call and let us know. IF she was terminated or if she resigned--could have gone either way. When you are asked for your resignation, it is called a "resignation" but it is really a "termination". I suspect that she left on her own, and my speculation is that she left because of some fundamental changes that are coming down shortly. But it could be otherwise.
ReplyDeleteTo anonymous. I agree that bashing CCL is not professional. But if an agent does not personally like one brand of supplier, of course they are going to try and influence the customer. That is why clients some to us for our opinions and so forth. Some people are subtle about it and others are less so much.
Take a look at this website. If I had the experiences this agency did with Carnival (or any other supplier) I too would probably assume that posture
http://www.ticket2gotravel.com/Scripts%20and%20Files/nocarnival.htm
John, in addition to "anonymous", I have taken the liberty to click on the link you supplied. I agree with this person that it is bad business to talk badly about a vendor... especially while using information from ONE vendor's opinions that isn't supported by any facts.
ReplyDeleteYes, there were incidents in the past with Carnival. Notice that the date of thee "letter" was almost 2 and 1/2 years ago. There haven't been any recent incidents with Carnival since then... have there?
I also know that there have been many companies who have had bad ratings at some point or anotheer that did a total 180 and are rated among the top companies around.
Personally, I have been on Carnival... aside from the "Birthday Bash", and Haven't seen anything alarming. I have also done ship inspections and I do know what to look out for when it comes to sanitation.
Keep in mind that Carnival is the ONLY cruise line that offers a satisfaction guarantee to those who do cruise with them.
Most of my cruising clients do prefer Carnival. In no way did I urge them to go with Carnival over RCCL. It's just what they tell me they prefer. Yes, this was during the time when RCCL was still doing business with YTB.
Also, out of curiocity, Mr., Mrs., Ms. (which are you) anonymous... I also wonder where you stand in this debate. I mean, are you a TA, YTB, vendor, or just an interested person.
Correction:
ReplyDelete1 and a half years ago.
John, I am not in tight with Vicki. I simply stated that in order to get the FACTS as to why Vicki went from CCL to RCCL, we must get them from the source.. Vicki. Until then, everythig else will just be speculation.
ReplyDeleteProud is now in experienced sanitation worker....is there anything you haven't done?
ReplyDeleteProud--please make sure that YTB is aware that you feel it is "bad business' to "talk badly" about a vendor. They seem to have forgotten that with their responses to RCCL. Oh, while you are at it you might as well remind yourself and the other 150,000 of you that also did. How many times have I heard "2nd rate cruiseline and insignificant vendors" from the mouths of YTB?
ReplyDeleteThere are issues with EVERY cruise line and the fact that you have seen none on Carnival indicates that you are personally either not selling enough or are not being an agent to your clients. Of course most people have a great time, but it is the old saying, when you do right, you are lucky if someone tells one person. If you don't you are lucky if they ONLY tell 1000.
And since you are now the sanitation expert, can you maybe head to Miami and see what you can do to eliminate the Norovirus on these ships? IT does have some of my clients concerned. Maybe you can build a downline and a 9X9 matrix payment scheme to rid the world of Noro...then move onto AIDS and Cancer.
I never said I was a sanitation worker. There are many professions where knowing about sanitation is required. No, it's not limited to garbage... LOL!
ReplyDeleteAs far as your list of viruses, John, those are not "ship" viruses. They are carried on the ships, in the hotels, around towns, etc. by infected people who could have contracted the diseases from where they live.
And John, YTB is no longer doing business with RCCL. You travel agents ARE still doing business with Carnival. There's a big difference. If a vendor is relying on a TA to help generate sales, and that TA is talking bad about that vendor, then what's a vendor to think?
ReplyDelete"When someone comes to you to set up a cruise on Carnival, do you recommend another cruiseline to them because you don't like Carnival personally?"
ReplyDeleteOkay Interested party/anonymous. I personally do not sell CCL, there are not CCL brochures at the Agency I am at - this pre-dates the MLM flap. CCL is not a "preferred" vendor with my Consortium.
If a client comes in asking for CCL, I will ask a lot of questions about why and I will show them how another line might be the better on for them (especially for a group). If the client still believes that CCL is the right line for him/her, I will certainly sell it but I will levy a per cabin "management" fee ont he booking. BUT I will do my best to sell them to a line that I believe is a better "value" for him/her. The definition of "best deal" is always very fluid - cheapest is not alwasy "best".
As for MLM predictions and RCL - I suspect that if RCL, via Vicki, does welcome the MLMs back, it won't be before the third quarter of the year. I did think for a while that Joystar had the best chance at re-instatement, at least until they put up their "Royal Mistake" site - but now that site is down, so...........
As for Vicki moving over - well on paper it is better to be a Sr. VP of Sales across the lines, rather than of just one line (as she was a Carnival Corp.). I suspect her move has more to do with her long-time mentor (Bob Dickinson) retiring than it does with anything else. Sometimes when top leadership changes and you are part of that team, it is just best to leave. I think she got very lucky with the timing here - that there was the vacancy at RCL is just a great coincidence for her.
I wish her luck and I hope she continues to make progress on her journey back to the light.....
CTA in MD said, "I will certainly sell it but I will levy a per cabin "management" fee ont he booking."
ReplyDeleteIn other words, you will sort of "penalize" the client for wanting you to book them on Carnival by charging them extra?
I hope this isn't the case, and you are really referring to the minimum down payment Carnival requires to reserve a cabin until full payment can be obtained.
"As for Vicki moving over - well on paper it is better to be a Sr. VP of Sales across the lines, rather than of just one line (as she was a Carnival Corp.). I suspect her move has more to do with her long-time mentor (Bob Dickinson) retiring than it does with anything else. Sometimes when top leadership changes and you are part of that team, it is just best to leave. I think she got very lucky with the timing here - that there was the vacancy at RCL is just a great coincidence for her."
I'm glad someone undrstands! This is a point I tried to make, but since I am with YTB, it's not considered valid and John must believe that Vicki moved because of YTB. Now that you also see the forrest through the trees, maybe others will too.
Proud---I have never said she moved because of YTB. To be honest, you guys are really not all that important.
ReplyDeleteI said it was odd and that because of her departure (as strange as the timing is) there likely will be changes made at Carnival. I suggested one of them might be a net environment and if that was the case, YTB (with all their cruise eggs in one basket) would be SOL.
Comprehension is a wonderful thing.
John, did I say you personally? Did I use your name in my last comment? No... and NO. I was referring to those who try to make a connection between Vicki and YTB.
ReplyDeleteYes John, comprehension is a wonderful thing. Maybe you could try it sometime.
:p
Uhm, yes you did
ReplyDeleteI'm glad someone undrstands! This is a point I tried to make, but since I am with YTB, it's not considered valid and John must believe that Vicki moved because of YTB. Now that you also see the forrest through the trees, maybe others will too.
Here's another newsflash. You're not that important either. the vendors are well capable of selling their own products, yet they choose other outlets to do so. The key word is "choose".
ReplyDeleteTo think that you are any more important than YTB, Travelocity, Expedia, etc. is naive. None of us agents are more important than the other. Come to think of it, the most important ones in the travel industry... or any industry for that matter are the clients.
Carefully step off your self created pedestal before you fall off.
Well let me step up to the plate and apologize for that. Sorry John.
ReplyDeleteNow you can either accept my apology or try to put a spin on it. Which kind of person will you be?
It is meant for those who do try to blame Vicki's move because of her dealings with YTB.
My point to this was that because sonmeone from YTB stated that they have nothing to do with ech other, it is automatically counted as BS. When a TTA states the same thing, it is then accepted.
I am NOT a liar. I don't appreciate being called a liar bu people who refuse to see past their own egos to try to understand other points of view.