When someone says, "Your reputation precedes you.", it is usually said as a compliment. Well, I am not so sure about that in this instance.
This article, titled Here Comes YTB & Everyone Can Be A Travel Agent is about a week old, but it does indicate that the welcome mat in Canada might have some slippery spots as well!
Here is what some of our industry comrades to the North had to say:
- ACTA President Christiane Théberge says the association “will not work with anyone who does not adhere to professional standards. We are promoting the integrity of the profession and the value of trained travel agents.”
- At CSTAR, President Bruce Bishins says the multi-level model wouldn’t bother him, if the objective was to recruit people with a genuine wish to become professional travel agents. “The wider the channel, the better the channel: If the intent is to bring on people and make them professional, I don’t have a problem with the MLM model. But I’m not in favour of any business model that seeks to make consumers agents themselves. Where I find the model disturbing…it doesn’t appeal to those seeking to be professional travel agents.”
- At the Canadian Institute of Travel Counsellors, President Steve Gillick also sees suppliers as being the key to fighting an onslaught of undereducated travel sellers. “One can only hope that these suppliers take some responsibility and support the travel industry in a more proactive way than they have been doing up to now. There are methods of determining whether an agent ID card is legitimate or not. Too many suppliers, unfortunately, drop the ball when it comes to weeding out the legitimate professional travel counsellors from those who are not seriously selling travel services but instead, are looking for industry freebies.”
Snicker snicker
ReplyDeleteSo…do you think it might be fair for us YTB’ers to ask “Who the Hell is Bruce Parkinson?”
ReplyDeleteFor that matter how ‘bout Don Burgess and Meredith Ebbin.
What type of industry accreditation do any of these folks have in either Travel or MLM?
Fair is fair don’t you think? If we are to provide documentation of the validity and credibility of those that support our model, why isn’t the same done for those that oppose it?
Snicker all you want guys, the LA BBB posted something about YTB back in July of 2005 about YTB being a raw deal. We had less that 20,000 at the time.
We now have over 140,000 of us.
Thinking articles like this is going to stop this company from the rapid growth is a pipe dream.
It’s much like telling people that not one of the 700 at your Founders Tour Meeting has a chance of making any money when your looking at 30 Directors at the front of the room.
Ignoring facts doesn’t make it true.
And parading 30 directors in front of a room (0.05% of 58,218 active reps) is supposed to motivate me???
ReplyDeleteI make more money in the stock market and investing in real estate - and have better odds!
YTB is a big joke.
"We now have over 140,000 of us."
ReplyDeleteUse the real numbers, not the persuasive one - you should be saying this:
"We now have over 305,033 of us, however, only 58,218 of us are making any money"
It reminds me of the whiners and complainers when WalMart comes to town. And just like the anti-WalMart crowd, you will never change their minds.
ReplyDeleteBut I can certainly say that about the whiners and complainers, they have their John Freneye talking points down. Must have got their training from the Clintons . . . a little bit of truth and a ton of spin.
"a little bit of truth and a ton of spin"
ReplyDeleteSure you aren't talking about YTB?
Bruce Parkinson, Don Burgess, and Meredith Ebbin . . . unhappy about YTB coming to Canada? Sorry, folks, it's happening.
ReplyDeleteIt was great to be at the YTB National Convention last August watching a video presentation of the Former Prime Minister of Canada welcoming YTB to his Country in February. Snicker, snicker . . .
And how does the Former Prime Minister of (I believe a Province, not the entire country) Canada have any right to welcome YTB?
ReplyDeleteFormer prime minister? What about the current one...and honestly who cares. Is it supposed to impress someone? The day YTB quits the pyramid BS and becomes a legitimate TRAVEL AGENCY with people that work and understand the actual business itself..maybe then I'll be impressed. Right now its deplorable how they prey on the innocent with the "travel like a travel agent" and promises of riches. But as long as Coach gets rich..who cares right?
ReplyDeleteTypical comments from Doug. At least those people have titles...at least you can find information on the net about them.
ReplyDeleteDoug you are no different than the rest of the YTB crows. When something is brought up, you change the subject. When you answer about the DR and or about Phil, then you have the right to ask. YTB is all about scamming people and your just upset that it has been shown that you have let Scammers and fake doctors into the "business". Your fluff is about as interesting as Toms. Deflect, deflect, deflect.
Anonymous said..."And how does the Former Prime Minister of (I believe a Province, not the entire country) Canada have any right to welcome YTB?"
ReplyDeleteYes Anon, the ENTIRE country. You might have missed my previous post below regarding John Truly's wecome to Canada message to YTB.
And TravelLisa, why are you not able to give credit where credit is due. Just becasue Mr. Truly is not the current PM of Canada does not discount the validity of his wecome message. Then you say, "who cares"? Maybe you don't but there are a lots of folks that do!! He held office in one of the worlds greatest countries. You are sitting in a tiny little office as a travel agent.
"Scam, if you had attended the YTB conference last year, you would have seen a video from John Turner, a former Canadian Prime Minister. In the video he welcomes YTB to Canada. He commended YTB for doing it right (regarding legalities) before setting up business in Canada. That was a very powerful "Wecome to Canada" message!"
Travellisa . . . YTB has no desire whatsoever to conform to what you desire. We're getting along just fine as we are, thank you.
ReplyDeletePrey on the innocent . . . LOL. $450 and $50 a month with no need to sign a contract? Boy, that's really getting into a person's pocket! A Cruise Planner with AMEX Travel for $10,000 . . . now we're talking some money.
I sleep very well at night knowing 600 plus happy RTAs on my Team happily pay their $50 a month.
One last thing, TL . . . read Doug B's post today. You will see all of the resources that YTB supplies to RTAs for travel training and continuing education. Maybe you can then relax a bit from your clueless YTB rants.
I have nothing against Canada or its former or current prime ministers. Was it supposed to impress me that YTB was welcomed..sorry it didn't. When they actually have agents up and running "legally and properly" in Canada..abiding by all their rules and regulations we will see how it all works out. Til then only time will tell.
ReplyDeleteWhen they can surpass #1 or #2 in total TRAVEL COMMISSIONS not website sales, and take down the actual agencies that work for what they do...maybe then I'll be impressed. They toss around the 150000 whatever RTA's on a daily basis...but don't say that only 1/2 of them actual sell anything. The top tier people make money, the bottom get nothing...then when a former YTB person says they've failed...they call BS and deem them liars (nice way to treat your own kind).
Respect is not given..its earned. When they can earn it..maybe I'll show a bit more.
TL . . . Getting you to show respect to YTB is like getting a liberal Democrat to respect a Republican President. Won't happen. You're set in your ways. No problem, we'll just recruit your neighbor and lots of RTAs in Canada.
ReplyDeleteSay "YES" to YTB in CANADA! That's what the former Prime Minister said.
Excuse me, can you find anyone named John Truly on this list of all Canadian Prime Ministers?
ReplyDeletehttp://www2.parl.gc.ca/Parlinfo/Compilations/FederalGovernment/PrimeMinisters/Biographical.aspx?Language=E
Perhaps I missed it, I did quickly scan. I believe John Truly never was a PM of Canada, but perhaps of one of the Provinces.
CTA in MD said..."Excuse me, can you find anyone named John Truly on this list of all Canadian Prime Ministers?"
ReplyDeleteExcuse me CTA, my mistake. John Turner is the correct name.
When Pierre Trudeau resigned Mr. Turner finished out Trudeau's term.
CTA in MD said. "I believe John Truly never was a PM of Canada, but perhaps of one of the Provinces."
ReplyDeleteSo CTA, how many PM's are there in each Province. This is a test. So study hard. ;>)
I'm not sure. I suspect this guy was a MP - Minister of Parliament - which I think I understand is akin to a Senator, however, there are no internet references to him at all.
ReplyDeleteWhy does YTB keep making such mistakes as they reference people.
I am not sure I understand the Canadian Government System, but I think (and please - I think, I don't know) that each Province has it's own Parliament (like each US State has it's own Senate) and there is Prime Minister of each.
I would be very thankful if a Canadian could straighten this out for us. But once again it looks like YTB is guilty of accepting someone's self-reported credentials rather than checking up on them.
Okay, missed that Score Keeper - so the guy was not elected and he was PM for 3 months, how many years ago?
ReplyDeleteFormer prime ministers are happy to accept money to promote a company just like what's his name with Priceline. He's paid to say what he says even if he would never consider using them. Now, if you got the current Prime Minister...oh yeah, can't do that.
ReplyDeleteLOL recruit away, if they are foolish enough to join, thats on them. If you think your taking business away from me, think again. I handle multi-million dollar corporations, and music management. They are not likely to be booking online any time soon.
ReplyDeleteAs for the respect part..you are wrong. There are some in the YTB that I do respect their opinions (like Doug) because they are thought out and actually work for what they have. What I don't have respect for is those that simply feed off the work of others and do nothing. If you join YTB to actually sell travel, attend courses, WORK FOR A LIVING, then power to you. I don't agree with YTB's stance in this industry and I am entitled to that opinion. I do not come on this board to spew hate or name calling as others do. I am here to defend my title, one in which I've put 20 years of hard work into.
CTA in MD said..."Okay, missed that Score Keeper - so the guy was not elected and he was PM for 3 months, how many years ago?"
ReplyDelete17th John Turner
(Liberal) June 30, 1984
September 17, 1984
Designated June 16, 1984 (non-MP)
Travellisa's latest WORDS OF WISDOM . . . "Feed off of the work of others and do nothing".
ReplyDeleteSo Doug works and I don't . . . OK. He is nice to you while you purport that anyone who joins YTB is a fool. If he want to be nice, good for him. I'm not exactly cozy with people that feel that way about my Team or prospective RTAs. And I hate to rain on your parade . . . Doug also "feeds off of others", as you say. And here's a little secret for you, TL . . . I bet if you ask him, he will tell you that he loves the YTB Compensation Program.
YTB and CANADA: A GREAT MIX . . .
Eddie said..."Former prime ministers are happy to accept money to promote a company just like what's his name with Priceline. He's paid to say what he says even if he would never consider using them. Now, if you got the current Prime Minister...oh yeah, can't do that."
ReplyDeleteEddie, your downplay comment was to be expected. If we even got the current PM to welcome YTB, you still wouldn't say that was great. You would downplay that as well. No one of ANY credibility that said a nice thing about YTB would make you happy. Even Jo Mama.
LB I don't even know you, so was I referring to you directly...NO. Defensive? I said nothing about your work, or your RTA's. As for Doug, yes he may be a Rep as well, but he seems to actually work at the travel side of it. He doesn't come on this board to attack or name call, as others do. So far MAJORITY of the YTB people I've run into online, in person etc, HAVEN'T A CLUE about this industry at all. Thats what pisses me off.
ReplyDeleteAs for YTB moving to Canada, Bermuda or Never Never Land..I don't think it will ever be a great mix..considering the reputation in the industry so far...but again..with time comes answers.
Have a blessed day :)
LB I don't even know you, so was I referring to you directly...NO. Defensive? I said nothing about your work, or your RTA's. As for Doug, yes he may be a Rep as well, but he seems to actually work at the travel side of it. He doesn't come on this board to attack or name call, as others do. So far MAJORITY of the YTB people I've run into online, in person etc, HAVEN'T A CLUE about this industry at all. Thats what pisses me off.
ReplyDeleteAs for YTB moving to Canada, Bermuda or Never Never Land..I don't think it will ever be a great mix..considering the reputation in the industry so far...but again..with time comes answers.
Have a blessed day :)
Anonymous said:
ReplyDelete“When you answer about the DR and or about Phil, then you have the right to ask.”
Actually, I did answer those questions, and my comments were ignored. However, since you brought up Phil, I find it a perfect example of why someone needs to verify the source before drinking the Kool-aid.
It’s been reported here time and time again about Phil being a “Scam Artist” based on a web site designed by Bob Burtis called worldwidescam.info
While I know that a site like this is taken as Gospel simply because it reports derogatory comments about Phil and YTB by those that want to expose YTB in a bad light, Bob Burtis himself appears to have scammed a few people of his own to the tune of $8.2 Million.
You can find the legal documents of his Bankruptcy papers here.
If you would like to consider Bob Burtis “credible” after a stunt like that, be my guest, but if Bob Burtis has motive, and took the time to doctor a video of Phil speaking, how hard would it be to doctor an e-mail or two? And you think I’m gullible…
Shcaweat!
In the meantime, all we’ve been hearing about here is how all the people at the top make all the money, and if you didn’t get in early you don’t have a shot of making money in YTB, while at the same time bringing to light that Phil recruited some 200 Plus people into his Power Team since September to make Coach’s Birthday Bash and made some $80K by doing so.
Some of you kids really don’t know how silly you look to those of us who are involved in this business model and have experienced first hand how this model works.
If you don’t want to consider the source of this article, be my guest. I’m simply trying to educate those that are willing to listen and learn.
Now…I’ve just exposed one source as not being all that credible, and I’m simply asking that you verify a source that looks to be nothing more than something a 12 year old put together, without any documentation or credentials to speak of.
Do I have to ask again or are we going to continue to play games?
All this crap is your reality, not mine.
PS - Lisa...The YTB Comp Plan does ROCK!
You show me an elected official that will accept payment to endorse a company and I will show you a soon to be ex- elected official. Maybe a new jailbird. Yale or Jail?
ReplyDeleteHey pal, you pay me 10,000.00 to say some thing nice about YTB and I will. Like Mr Turner, I have no shame when it comes to taking Coaches $$$. Let me know if we can make a deal any time soon....
I can see the headlines now...
olescorekeeper said...
ReplyDeleteCTA in MD said..."Okay, missed that Score Keeper - so the guy was not elected and he was PM for 3 months, how many years ago?"
17th John Turner
(Liberal) June 30, 1984
September 17, 1984
Designated June 16, 1984 (non-MP)
So he was PM for 3 months almost 25 years ago - somehow I find that as meaningful as Bob Dole welcoming some company to the US.
So what about Dr Bob, Doug?
ReplyDeleteEddie said, "Hey pal, you pay me 10,000.00 to say some thing nice about YTB and I will."
ReplyDeleteThere goes your credibility once....
"Like Mr Turner, I have no shame when it comes to taking Coaches $$$. Let me know if we can make a deal any time soon...."
And there goes your credibility twice!
You mean you won't pay me? The heck with my credibility. I'm just an poster on a blog site. I say Mr Turners is far more suspect. Would you have any idea how much he made on that deal?
ReplyDeleteAnd, Scorekeepers, even ole ones, are supposed to be unbiased so join the 'no credibility' club. Not that you need my invitation to join of course...
ReplyDeleteLB travel---hello...you do sign a contract with YTB. For both the Rep and RTA business. I can send it to you if you like.
ReplyDeletelbtravel said...
Travellisa . . . YTB has no desire whatsoever to conform to what you desire. We're getting along just fine as we are, thank you.
Prey on the innocent . . . LOL. $450 and $50 a month with no need to sign a contract? Boy, that's really getting into a person's pocket! A Cruise Planner with AMEX Travel for $10,000 . . . now we're talking some money.
I sleep very well at night knowing 600 plus happy RTAs on my Team happily pay their $50 a month.
One last thing, TL . . . read Doug B's post today. You will see all of the resources that YTB supplies to RTAs for travel training and continuing education. Maybe you can then relax a bit from your clueless YTB rants.
January 29, 2008 12:28 PM
Eddie said...
ReplyDeleteSo what about Dr Bob, Doug?
Dr. Bob provided a document. It's a waist to spend time either defending or slandering anyone’s credibility when you have documentation like this with a bunch of people who don't know tax law. (I'm not saying that I know it all either Eddie.)
I asked everyone to take this document to a CPA to validate it. What a good CPA will do is help you with the documentation required to keep you out of trouble with the IRS.
I've deducted many (not all) of the line items on that list. However, given the proper opportunity in my business I could take advantage of every single line item. Perfectly legal and legit.
If I'm ever flagged for an audit, I have the documentation to back it up.
I think you two are on different pages....
ReplyDeleteThe Dr. Bob I believe is the Dr. Bob Seligman, PhD, RTA, Harvard and Oxford Graduate, Spymaster, Designer of Counter Terrorism unit for Secret Service, Right hand man to Barry DillAr, senior executive at GE, Boeing, New York Life and others.
John,
ReplyDeleteCould be...if so, my appologies.
I seem to recall reading something about this guy some time back here. Probably wrote it off as mindless chatter.
Kind of like this article referenced above...
(Did I just say that out loud?)
;-P
Yes, John . . . I'm sure when I check into a Hotel, I technically sign a contract.
ReplyDeleteMy point is this (and most reasonable people would understand what I meant) . . . you are not obligated to pay the $49.95 each month. You can opt out at any time without a buy-out like a cellphone contract.
You've resorted to "hair-splitting" on this one, John.
I am not splitting hairs on it at all. It is a contract. Albeit one that has a relatively easy out clause. But it also obligates you in other ways....
ReplyDeleteyour customers are not yours. you are compelled to adhere to local laws, etc.
Just because a contract has an easy out does not negate that it is a contract.
Hey, I hear YTB is promoting Scott Tomer as a future president of the United States. Now now YTB people don't go saying that there is a chance. That has about as much truth to it as this "DR" and Phil story does.
ReplyDelete"Some of you kids really don’t know how silly you look to those of us who are involved in this business model and have experienced first hand how this model works."
ReplyDeleteWhat you don't realize is that there are some of us reading this blog that have been in MLM's over the years, many years in fact, and have highs and lows, and finally have seen the light - and stopped drinking the Kool-Aid - I know how the model works, even YTB - and I also have the ruined relationships and friendships to prove it.
Long time friends, friends from FIRST GRADE, friends who went thru thick and thin in high school, even kept touch during the college years.
Friends who are no longer friends now because of MLM's. Family members who don't speak to each other now - because of MLM's. Neighbors, whose kids were good friends - barely acknowledging each other now - because of MLM's. Saw people divorce - because of MLM's.
I earned money - lots of it. Bought lots of "stuff". Developed MLM relationships - whoopee.
I've experienced the MLM business model/cult.
I'd give it all back to have those friends and family again.
You're the silly kid Doug.
JF . . . thanks for at least admitting the "easy out".
ReplyDeleteMy point was this (and I compared the financial cost to Cruise Planners with AMEX) . . . for a business that costs $50 a month in overhead (and you can cancel the $50 AT ANY TIME), people like travellisa get all worked up about YTB "preying" on people. The monetary cost of having a YTB business is much ado about nothing.
You cannot compare YTB to Cruise Planners or Amex. That is like saying that the rusted out Yugo is the same as the Cocaine White Bentley.
ReplyDeleteLook at any number of different hosts--even Joystar and you may have a chance of coming close to comparing apples to apples.
If renting a website can be considered 'having a business' then someone needs a little more it is rather than what it might be...
ReplyDeleteThese are not good economic times and some are a bit desperate for extra income. I understand that.
As a student of history and economics I think I'll take a look back and see if this may have peaked before. It's likely. Hey, I might go for my Phd if I find enough to write about. Dr Eddie PhD sounds good. Looks good too.
thanks, and cood night.
Anyone want to join the Credibility Club? Discounts for all Johns blog folk. I think we are in timeshares this week. I'll have to check.
It's funny how the comment "renting a website" always comes to the table. Her's a newsflash for you all! traditionals all talk about their host company. This means that all you work at home travel agents (eg. Cruise Planners) are also "renting" a website!
ReplyDeleteTalk about the pot calling the kettle black!
Those of you... and i'm sure there are very few who don't have a "host" have had your website designed for you which has cost you thousands upon thousands to do. This is where the traditional agent I mentioned comes in. She went this route, and therefore has to pay $450 in fees each monh to stay in business after paying $8700 to even start it!
You may not have monthly fees to pay, but I assure you that your host does! You say that you have a 80/20 or 90/10 Commission rate. well, did you ever think of where that 20 or 10% goes to? It goes to your host and part goes to pay the fees to stay afloat! come to think of it further, you are paying fees. you just don't realize it.
Proud said, "She went this route, and therefore has to pay $450 in fees each month to stay in business after paying $8700 to even start it!"
ReplyDeleteProud, the time is coming soon when some of these TTA's are going to wake up one morning and "feel" they are being scammed paying these ridiculous fees when they could have taken advantage of the YTB opportunity of a one time $500 setup fee and $49.95 per month, which can also can become easily FREE.
What about Magic Johnson's travel company it cost 7500.00 and it is a mlm what is your thought on this???
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
ReplyDelete“I know how the model works, even YTB - and I also have the ruined relationships and friendships to prove it.”
Eddie, you have your first sign up in your Credibility Club! “Anonymous” says he/she can prove it. LMFAO!
PS – In regard to Magic Johnson being an MLM…
While it has many of the same qualities of an MLM, technically it can not be defined as an MLM because of this $7500 fee. (MLM’s can not charge more than a $500 entry fee from my understanding.)
Magic Johnson Travel is defined as a “Franchise” and gets a pass from most simply because of that title.
Again--this has gone very far off the topic of the post.Typical but I will play.
ReplyDeleteProud--most people will license content, ala OLA or similar. If their host decided to go belly up (or was deemed an illegal pyramid scheme by the FTC) they would still own their website, their clients, and the information they put on it.
So what do you get? Clients--nope, domain--nope, content--nope. Continuing paychecks--nope
Proud, John is right on this one. Websites don't cost thousands of dollars. I pay about $250 per year to license content from OnlineAgency, and do the rest of the web development myself. I pay a monthly hosting fee to JSweb Technology to host the site. (Disclaimer, I also own JSweb Technology, so I'm paying myself).
ReplyDeleteI also don't understand your railing about the 20% of our 80/20 split and where that money goes. In addition to your monthly fees you get only a 60/40 split. So, my net commission check for the same sale as you would make (assuming my host and YTB get the same rate from the supplier) is 1/3 bigger on each and every sale. Yes, 80% is 1/3 bigger than 60%, do the math.
As John noted, I own the website, the client list, contact information and more. If I decide to change host agencies, all that comes with me. Can you do that at YTB (or any other MLM such as Traversus or World Ventures - just to give equal time)? Nope!
"Magic Johnson Travel is defined as a “Franchise” and gets a pass from most simply because of that title."
ReplyDeleteBecause of the title?? Now who is looking silly!
Did you ever look at a "Uniform Franchise Offering Circular" that all franchisors must furnish to prospective franchisees?
It is an extensive document, with 23 required sections that specify everything someone needs to know before purchasing a franchise.
If YTB had to produce such a document to all potential members before they joined, disclosing all the information that it requires, I doubt YTB would have as many members as it does now.
travelpro said:
ReplyDelete"...It’s been reported here time and time again about Phil being a “Scam Artist” based on a web site designed by Bob Burtis called worldwidescam.info..."
So Phil Piccolo can't be a scam artist because maybe Bob Burtis is?! Diversionary comment, as usual.
Let's face it, the only way we'll hear the truth about Phil Piccolo from YTBers is if he ever leaves YTB.
MJ doesn't get a "pass" because of a "title" - it is a franchise, just like Quiznos, McDonald's - it's in no way an MLM - they don't get money monthly for a "downline" and they are not encouraged to build one. They also have limited the number of franchises in a given geographical area - they're not looking to recruit MLM-style.
ReplyDeleteMaybe ya’ll missed the Magic Johnson Recruiting Memo?
ReplyDeleteReplace “MLM” with “FDM” (Franchise Development Manager), who’s job description is to “solicit the purchase of franchise operation by contacting persons who meet the standards of the organization” (Meaning it’s best if you’re a minority?)
It’s the first the first home-based travel agent franchise “network”.
It pays $75K “plus commission”.
Phil P was paid this same amount in YTB in 3 months for the Birthday Bash for “soliciting” and he’s a scammer because some no name puttz says he is.
Meanwhile back at Travel MLM, Magic Johnson gets a pass because nobody here gets that this “Franchise” is nothing more than a glorified MLM that uses different words and terminology and targets home-based minorities.
What makes it even more hilarious is that they are in bed with the same company who all you Traditionalists are glorifying for terminating YTB because we don’t “solicit”…we “recruit”, we don't pay “commission”, we "build a downline”.
Sigh...
You can lead a horse to water...
So the person in charge of "recruiting" franchisees at McDonald's or Dunkin Donuts makes those organizations MLM's?
ReplyDeleteWhat about the HR recruiter at my place of work? He gets a salary and commission for hiring employees - is he creating an MLM?
THE BIG DIFFERENCE HERE DOUG is that the people that these people are hiring or recruiting are not charged with recruiting members themselves.
Oh, and those organizations make their money by selling burgers and donuts - not by recruiting more members - as the numbers show that YTB makes 70%++ of its money from.
"It’s the first the first home-based travel agent franchise “network”."
ReplyDeleteWrong again. There are many others!
It's just the most recent.
Go drink some more Kool-Aid.
LOL! The Kool-Aid was poured by Magic Johnson smart ass, go tell him he's “wrong”.
ReplyDeleteI provide links and documentation for a reason...you should read it before you stick your foot in your mouth.
Go crawl back into you MLMsurvivors.com hole where you can relish in being a victim with the rest of the pour souls who need to blame something else besides themselves for being broke and miserable.
(Sorry gang...we all have our limits.)
Oh Douggie that wasn't very nice.
ReplyDeleteOh Douggie you also can lead a YTB person to jump off a cliff if Scott or the Coach say so. I doubt you are even making a business out of what you say you are. More fluff from another mentally deranged moron. So much for Mr. Niceguy Doug, just like the rest of the YTB people....they have mental issues.
ReplyDeleteHey guys---reminder---please no personal attacks--not needed!
ReplyDeleteAs an outside observer of this debate, the problem I see here John is that any time Doug provides documentation to support his views these points are simply ignored and then he’s attacked. Doug does a VERY effective job of backing up what he knows. He also does a great job of pointing out double standards.
ReplyDeleteLook at the first question at the top of this post.
Nobody’s answered HIS question after some 60 comments and we still don't have any idea who this Bruce Parkinson guy is.
It's ignored and he's attacked.
Based on what I see, the only thing some CAN do is personally attack the person because they lack a response to the issue.
Again, as an outside observer, take it or leave it.
Reminds me of the line in “A Few Good Men”.
"YOU CAN’T HANDLE THE TRUTH!"
Glenn--good points for sure and I agree that Doug does a great job of offering counterpoints and backing up his arguments as best he can. I try to do the same and sometimes we are right on the money and other times we are off the mark.
ReplyDeleteAnd to answer the first question...apparently his is a columnist for Open Jaw which appears to be a trade publication. I am not sure if they are in print or solely online, but he appears to be a columnist with them--much like Mike Milligan or Nadine Godwin is with Travel Weekly.
Here is their about us page link
http://www.openjaw.com/contact.html
Argh - read through 62 comments just to read the same chit I've been reading for 3 years - just in a different thread . . .
ReplyDeleteLOL - too funny . . .
Tom
Ok...so we know who Parkinson is...but still nothing on Phil Piccolo. He's gone from being probably not even the same Phil Piccolo to having made 75,000$ in 3 months with YTB and not being a scammer (because only one person says he is).
ReplyDeleteWill we be reading about this new YTB superstar in the next issue of SFH...or is he someone they prefer not tell his history?
Well, since majority fo my clients have signed up for the newsletter on tavel deals, and have dealt with me one to one (in person), i have their e-mail addresses. If I decided to change companies... which i won't do, all i have to do is e-mail those people and let them know. Since i've dealt with many personally, those are the ones who would follow me.
ReplyDeleteAlso, about the 40% that YTB "keeps", well that goes back into the company towards paying the bills as well as paying the REPs and RTAs.
You will never see even a part of the 20% your host keeps.
Proud--I believe your contract prevents you from contacting those clients. I will check. ALso you cannot work with another MLM, so you would need to go to the dark side and become a TTA.
ReplyDeleteAnd do not be fooled by any sense of loyalty on your clients. Many will see it as a way to no longer be obligated (in a sense) to do business wiht you, or will find something that is a better deal or more convenient.
I took a quick look at Tomer's contract (posted yesterday) and I see HE gets to keep payments coming from ALL the YTBers even if he leaves the company.
ReplyDeleteConsumers who purchase soley on price point almost never show loyalty to a vendor.
ReplyDeleteProud says he deals with most people one on one, so one would hope that he has provided good service and they will stay with him. BUT, if any one of them went to a real Agent who gave them exceptional service (admittedly not all do - how many of us have gotten clients who came after a disatisfactory experience iwth another TA?), they will never go back to Proud with his "good" though perhaps not great or imaginative/creative service.
John,
ReplyDeleteActually, the contract has a rule regarding first contact. This means that I cannot go sending e-mails to people about YTB until they either contact me first via e-mail or subscribe to the Deals & Steals.
Also, I cannot join another MLM while in YTB, but if I left, i would be able to.
You really would want me to come to the dark side.
Iontop, how about posting Tomer's contract up on the blog so everyone can see it.
Proud it would probably take iontop a while to get it all typed up. Maybe by the end of summer he'll have it finnished.
ReplyDeleteJust go to YTB.com...click on Investors...then SEC Filings. It's all there...
ReplyDeleteI signed up for Deals and Steals on several YTB sites and no one has sent me anything. I guess that means there are no deals and steals?
ReplyDeleteI got one yesterday. They are kind of funny... like this
ReplyDeleteWeekend Escape:
San Diego, CA to Rochester, NY
The home of Kodak film boasts sights that even the most discriminating of shutterbugs can't resist.
Flight & Hotel Included
2 Nights from $309 per person
Does Rochester have such a huge market for YTB? Or is it just a leader?
And then offered some tips
* Make your hotel reservations in advance, especially if you are visiting a place in peak season.
* Do not depend solely on the hotel's alarm/wake up call service. Carry your own little alarm clock to catch an early morning flight or that pre-dawn sightseeing trip.
* When you check into your hotel, ask reception to give you a card with the hotel's name, address and telephone number. This will come in handy if you get lost or forget the name of your hotel.
* Check before traveling to see if your hotel has a hair dryer, iron, coffee maker, etc. to avoid having to pack and travel with these often bulky items.
Personally I have never heard of anyone traveling with a coffee maker, but....
What IS interesting on the Deals and Steals is that like the booking sites there is no indication as to who it is coming from. Is this from Aunt Bertha? When they are all about face to face relationship building you would think they would have maybe some contact numbers.
ReplyDeleteBut, if they do not identify the RTA that allows YTB to retain the client and perhaps send the blast out under the number of a member higher up on the pyramid!
I love Rochester NY at this time of year! Those pre-dawn sightseeing trips are not to be missed. But a flash light might be handier than a coffee pot. I can use it to find the card I dropped with my hotel name on it in 10 feet of snow. Then I can use it again when I try to find a payphone that isn't frozen solid (ahh that's why I need a coffee pot) at 5a in the morning to call my hotel to come and save me.
ReplyDeleteAll the time I'll be wondering why I left San Diego in the first place!
Thanks for the tips!
John, if you click on the "Book Travel Here" on the upper right hand side of the D&S e-flyer, it takes you directly to the website of the person whose website you are signed up under.
ReplyDeleteFor example, if you went to John Doe Travel dot com and signed up for the D&S there, when you click it, it would take you to John Doe Travel dot com.
Other info about the flyer...
If yoy know someone who may be interrested in a featured trip listed, you can forward it to a friend and they can use it. Also, the departure city could be changed to accomodate your travel plans.
Weekend Escape:
San Diego, CA to Rochester, NY
Well, Let's say you live in Orlando. you can change it to Orlando, Fl to Rochester, NY
I know you can click and go book travel, but as I have said all along 99% of those websites are just as useful--no names or nothing.
ReplyDeleteI am also unaware of a newsletter that can target your next vacation. Most will allow you to "change the city". It is just baiting the hook with the newsletter--we all do it. Paint the picture of how great a trip to XYZ will be and hopefully they will call you or book a trip with you--maybe to XYZ or maybe not. But I have to question the selection of Rochester. Who knows, maybe YTB has a lot of photography historians out there.
It seems that everyone wants to know the truth about Phil Piccolo and YTB and they don't feel they'll ever hear it until Phil leaves. Wrong. I happen to know the truth and everyone can take it for what it is worth -- even those who drone the Piccolo mantra about Bob Burtis having his bankruptcies. What Bob Burtis has or has not done does NOT change who Phil Piccolo is, what he has done and what he IS doing one iota.
ReplyDeletePhil stole the birthday bash away from whomever the second place winner was. This is how he did it:
Phil started another one of his famous (or infamous?) programs and called it DubaiMLM. He made inferences to Dubai Dollars and free money and people went totally nuts signing up into the program from all over the world.
Switch to YTB for a moment. Phil is doing his darnedest to sign up RTAs. He is also DYING financially because he has no income streams coming in. He needs money. So, he devises a clever plan to separate people from their money at $500 a whack. He starts telling everyone who signs up into YTB that they can be an RTA for free. He has access to a Florida travel agency (K & E International, Inc/KE Travel located at 4607 Lake Worth Rd, Lake Worth, FL 33463-3451 Phone: (561) 966-9808 who begins handing out FREE travel ID cards to everyone and anyone who signs up with Phil. Now, because Phil is giving away these RTA positions, he's not making any money. So, everyone who does this RTA thing must also participate in his "lead program" - $500 a pop. They are "GUARANTEED" ten sign ups a month and 3 conversions out of those ten. He tells them he is getting these super qualified leads from a high-end source and says they normally go for $1500 a month but that they are running a "special" and he'll get them in on the lead program for just $500. So people begin jumping on it. Phil is now raking in $500 from each person signing up as an RTA. I'm sorry, how many RTAs did Phil sign up? Each of these paid him $500. So, instead of YTB getting the money, PHIL PICCOLO got the money.
Back to DubaiMLM. Everyone and everyone from all over the world is signing up into DubaiMLM. Since YTB is USA only, Phil can only use those leads that are here in the USA. Phil then takes the leads that have come into DubaiMLM and slams these people into YTB via a small sentence in one of his infamously long, boring and poorly worded emails that says they will be placed into a travel opportunity. So, the people from DubaiMLM are getting slammed into YTB, and the people from YTB who are paying $500 for ten leads are getting CRAP leads who know absolutely nothing about anything and are only interested in *free* money from DubaiMLM.
Isn't that nice? THAT is who Phil Piccolo is. THAT is how he won coach's birthday bash. THAT is how he cheated the second place winner out of their RIGHTFUL place. It makes me sick. I can't believe that whoever the second place winner was really worked the program and DESERVED to win -- yet slimy con-man Phil Piccolo gets the free pass right under YTB's nose.
I hear that he went to YTB headquarters to plead his cause and apparently fooled them into thinking he's just such a swell guy and is really just helping people. Right? I mean, after all, he has probably told them, "Look, I GAVE away the RTA positions and I made NO MONEY." When in actuality he was making $500 a month off of each person as long as they participated in his program.
Phil Piccolo is the consummate con-artist and don't allow anyone to tell you anything differently.
Thanks for the update on Phil. However, with an anonymous post, you really need to question the authenticity.
ReplyDeleteCould be true, or not. Just no way to know I guess. Perhaps if the ultimate #3 guy on the Bash Cruise wants to come forward--he would have been the guy that lost out right?
I'm anonymous for a reason. It isn't because I don't have proof -- I just prefer to remain anonymous for my own protection. Your wonderful Phil Piccolo last year set up some guy who crossed him and duct taped him to a chair, put duct tape over his eyes, and he and his "henchmen" slapped the snot out of the guy. I think there are a number of charges that would arise out of something like that, like probably felony kidnapping just to name one. Of course Piccolo was stupid enough to photograph the event -- and I just happen to have obtained one of the copies of that photograph. What is it about stupid, arrogant criminals that drives them to photograph or otherwise document their crimes? The funny thing about this is that there are a number of other people who would be able to independently verify the person in the photo I have and it is certainly authentic. Also, Piccolo had bragged about it to someone I know.
ReplyDeletePhil Piccolo is nothing but a common criminal who at some point will end up in jail.
First off he is not "my" Phil Piccolo. For the record, I have an inclination to believe you. But since it is an "anonymous" post, it naturally loses some credibility unfortunately.
ReplyDeleteIf there is some source you could let me know and I could verify, I would be more than happy to bring that to light as well.
The "your Phil Piccolo" was not directed at you, but at YTB. In other words, if one is in YTB then he is part of their group.
ReplyDeleteI will need your email address or some way of contacting you. Do you have a web address that contains any of your personal info?
john@jvegroup.net
ReplyDelete