To any of the YTB Affiliates, RTAs, or soon to come "Travel Agents" reading this blog, I suggest that you take this document to your attorney and get advice. One thing you need to know is that YTB reserved the right to change the terms (at their whim) when you originally signed up. By continuing to participate in the program, you are essentially agreeing to the new terms. Please get some professional advice, it will be the best $100 you ever spend.
With a 49 page document, you can imagine that there are a lot of issues. I will discuss (by page) the ones that seem the most critical to me.
- Page 7. CODE OF ETHICS. While they say that the founders of YTBTN have strong convictions, it does not seem to flow outward to the TSOs. There are still all sorts of questionable behavior and promotion going on. I feel that YTBTN does not care, until it becomes an issue.
- Page 9. Section 1.4 DELAYS. This is a frightening section as it allows YTBTN to default on any payments owed to the TSO for any number of reasons. Notably, government decrees or orders.
- Page 10. Section 2.1REQUIREMENTS TO BECOME AN AFFILIATE. It states to become a "Travel Agent" you must complete, enroll, and pay for ALL E-Campus modules. Currently there is no timeline for when all the modules will be available. Is YTB certifying people as "Travel Agents" when they complete only those available?
- Page 11. Section 2.4 GENERAL RESPONSIBILITIES OF A TRAVEL SITE OWNER. Section "b" prevents you from engaging any supplier in a dispute. Honestly, this is what agents do for their clients. Section "c" prevents you from advertising any trips online.
- Page 12. Section 2.6 TALENT RELEASE. I am not sure I woudl be willing to give YTBTN "lifetime" rights to my images, thoughts, and statements.
- Page 13, Section 3.2 ADVERTISING. This section precludes a TSO from using any promotional materials that were not produced by YTB. It further clarifies it that TSOs are not allowed to produce their own literature, ads, sales aids, promo materials, or internet web pages.
- Page 14. Section 3.3 INTERNET WEBSITES AND E-MAIL COMMUNICATIONS. This section says that the ONLY internet web page that you can use is the replicated site provided by YTBTN. TSOs are not allowed to design any other web site that that uses the YTB name, logos or promotes YTB either directly or indirectly.
- Page 15. Section 3.5. BLOGS, CHAT ROOMS, SOCIAL NETWORKS, ONLINE AUCTIONS, and OTHER ONLINE FORUMS. This prevents you from utilizing any blogs (Doug are you listening?), chat rooms, or essentially ANY internet means to to "market, sell, advertise, promote, or discuss YTBTN's products or services. Say goodbye to commenting on this blog by name, signatures on forums, the YTB room in WAHM, the YTB Family Ning Forum, all blogs and essentially all websites owned by TSOs that mention YTB.
- Page 15. Section 3.6 DOMAIN NAMES AND E-MAIL ADDRESSES. Gone are the days of having YTB featured in any of your email addresses or domains.
- Page 19. Section 3.16 CONFLICTS OF INTEREST NON-SOLICITATION. TSOs are not allowed to recruit other people from YTB or their customers into any other MLM company. Further, you are not allowed to recruit or solicit anyone in YTB or their customers for a year after you leave. This might actually make you an employee. Does not sound too independent to me.
- Page 20. Section 3.16 CONFLICTS OF INTEREST NON-SOLICITATION. You are not allowed to sell any competing products. With the addition of the lotions and potions and so forth, it seems that YTB is competing everywhere. And then there is the crazy (section "c") requirement about talking about other network marketing opportunities within 2 hours or 5 miles of any YTBTN event.
- Page 20. Section 3.18 GOVERNMENTAL APPROVAL OR ENDORSEMENT. Well, it is apparent that the California Attorney General is not endorsing YTB any time soon, but how may recruiting meetings have taken place where they say that YTB is legitimate and has been approved and been registered with "the Attorney General in all 50 states"?
- Page 21. Section 3.20 INCOME TAXES. Well, with the average TSO earning $139 a year in income, I suspect YTBTN saves a lot of money on printing these 1099s.
- Page 21, Section 3.21 INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR STATUS. From a lot of the other rules in this document, it seems that you are not that independent at all. I also find it interesting that they state you are not buying a franchise or a business opportunity. What is the opening line of every YTB presentation--we offer two separate "business opportunities"?
- Page 21. Section 3.22 TRAVEL SITE OWNER'S NAME. You cannot advertise that you are part of YTB in the phone book nor are you allowed to answer the phone like you are part of YTB. Hopefully, little Timmy will not answer a ringing phone, "Hello, YTB Travel"
- Page 23. Section 3.24 CONFIDENTIALITY. This is the most frightening page in the document for any one that is interested in selling travel. It specifically states that your customer information is the "exclusive property" of YTBTN. So, you work hard and find customers and YTBTN takes them from you and then owns them. Of course clients will do what they want, but EVERY other legitimate host has a provision that states that the clients belong to the agent. But you can be sure that if you leave, YTBTN will be marketing to your clients very heavily.
- Page 26. Section 4.8 SALE, TRANSFER OR ASSIGNMENT OF TSO'S BUSINESS. While the concept of someone actually selling this "business" is amusing in an of itself (I mean why would you not just buy a new one on sale for $250?), there is a clause to protect the upline at all costs. Also notable is the the clause that requires the purchaser to assume "all" obligations. I am not sure how YTBTN can legally require that a buyer assume all obligations. Most business sales are typically asset only transactions; liabilities remain with the seller.
- Page 30. Section 5.2 NON-DISPARAGEMENT. This says you are allowed to talk nice of YTBTN, but if you discover something that you disagree with, they will not address it at all. You are simply not allowed to voice any concern if they feel it is negative.
- Page 31. Section 5.4 VENDOR CONFIDENTIALITY/COMMUNICATIONS. You are no longer allowed to divulge the commission levels paid by vendors. So much for every recruitment presentation along with the examples.
- Page 32. Section 6.1 TRAVEL SALES. Customers must not be abandoned under any circumstances. (Unless they are in Atlanta and then that is ok because someone will step in). But my question is if YTBTN is serious about this, perhaps they ought to offer a method to contact the TSO on the websites. If you look at any site, there is still no way to contact the TSO and the minimal help offered still suggests to call the supplier directly for issues.
- Page 33. Section 7.1 BONUS AND COMMISSION QUALIFICATIONS. If you are not in COMPLETE compliance with all 49 pages of this document, YTBTN can elect to not pay you commissions or bonuses owed.
- Page 33. Section 7.2 ADJUSTMENTS TO BONUSES AND COMMISSIONS. This says that if the client cancels travel and the client is entitled to a refund, no commission will be paid. As any travel professional knows there are several instances where a client receives a refund and the commission is still paid.
- Page 34. Section 7.6 REPORTS. Apparently the big SAP program is not all that. Any reports not really guaranteed to be accurate. So if your client cancels and you do it through the Back Office, there is a possibility it might never make it.
- Page 36. Section 9.1 DISCIPLINARY SANCTIONS. This is a pretty extensive list and it seems they left out water boarding.
- Page 40. Section 10.2 SALES TAXES. I suspect (hope) this is a mistake, but this says YTBTN collects sales taxes on ALL transactions and remits them to the proper states. Well, many (if not most) states do not assess sales tax on travel. If YTBTN is collecting it, where is it going?
- Page 41. Section 11.1 EFFECT OF CANCELLATION. While most legitimate hosts will work with an independent contractor, YTBTN has refused to transfer any bookings. This further emphasizes that the clients do indeed belong to YTBTN.
And they are Gung Ho after that? How can any normal person agree to these terms? I'd like to know what a YTBer wh has READ IT IN FULL feels about it, and if they feel they are exempt (like Doug - meaning YTB plays favorites)
ReplyDeleteDo they really think people are going to take them seriously?
YTBers you REALLY need to go see your attorneys about it. Seriously. Even if this document wasn't YTB specific, if I got a document like that I wouldn't stand for it...but then again, YTBers fall for anything put out by Coach Daddy.
I mean, seriously?? I would love for a YTBer to come out and say this was the best thing they did for the company.
Looking at this:
Page 12. Section 2.6 TALENT RELEASE
Basically, you can't use YTB in any manner, but they can use your voice, your words, and exploit YOU. The same goes for those 'celebrities' that mention YTB (hahaaa), they can't get paid! But YTB can use you guys in all their marketing and practically anything they want.
Talk about lack of respect for REPs/RTAs.
Putting it bluntly. YTB OWNS YOU.
What is VERY interesting is that this document appears to have some teeth. I say some, because it appears to be very selective.
ReplyDeleteThe comments on many other Internet forums and blogs have decreased considerably since it came out. If you look at the widget I had here, all of the "named" commenters that were pro YTB have deleted their google profiles and now their comments are "named anonymous".
Travel Mom has had her blog censored again, and there have been several blogs that have been completely removed. The ones that remain are way behind in being updated.
However, there are some that appear to be exempt. Or maybe they have been given some time to comply.
But it is indeed a scary document. And if all these RTAs (or TSOs) are indeed "running a business", I agree, that a review by an attorney is in order. Legitimate businesses do not merely accept a business altering document like this upon the word of a man who calls himself "Coach".
And speaking of Coaches---did you see how many of them are out of jobs this week!
Well they may have written the document but what are they doing to back it up? As of yesterday Traveling Mom still had her blog up with a YTB logo on it, and had copied and pasted several travel offers and pictures on both of her blogs.
ReplyDeletehttp://urbancitytravl.blogspot.com/
http://bargaindestinationweddings.blogspot.com/
That is one of the most one sided contracts I have ever seen...
ReplyDeleteFurther- just about every YTBer is probably in violation in one way or another... hell they need a multi-part training program just to teach people everything they are NOT allowed do..
Here is the funny part.... How is YTB going to police them?
Seriously - they expect their reps over night to stop calling YTB "two separate business opportunities"?
Hey is this the same denyse from WHAM:
http://www.slideshare.net/denyse/ytb-travel-business-opportunity/
hell she even names the page business opportunity....
There are thousands of pages out there talking about YTB's business opportuntiies....
Too funny - maybe they should have made the rules BEFORE signing all the people up....
The funniest part is what I call the uncertainty and doubt....
Do you really trust YTB? If they government shuts them down, will they pay out?
Can you imaging if YTB sold all of their RTA information to other MLMs? There is this thing called the Do Not Call registry, but that doesn't apply to people like YTB who you have a business relationship with, and now that they own your data, your customers data etc in perpituity, they can sell it to whomever will pay them....
HELLO telemarkers......
Most likely ALL RTAs are in violation and this is YTB's out.
ReplyDeleteYTB will NOT pay out if they are shut down. They covered that in Page 9 section 1.4 front and center
This is the craziest contract I have ever seen! I am an employee at the Agency I work at and while I have a "non-compete" clause in my employment agreement, there is also one that is very clear that any clients I bring into the Agency are MINE and I can take them with me (should they choose to go) when/if I leave.
ReplyDeleteReal CTA in MD
This contract scares me and I am not even in YTB.
ReplyDeleteI was reading in Travel Pulse yesterday about all the agents at Joystar who hung in there and either refused or were in denial about what was going on and now are owed thousands in commissions which they may never see. It's sad. What's even sadder is that Josh and all of them hang in there and refuse to believe anything bad is going to happen and don't have a plan B. They have blind faith to Coach. And, Josh made a comment that it is sad we are trying to take his income away from him he uses to support his family. In all honesty, I don't wish anyone to go through what the Joystar people are. What is it going to take to wake up Josh, Doug, Gail, Regina and the other blind followers?
So does this mean that if the AG shuts them down that all RTAs that have pending commissions will not receive them?
ReplyDeleteI imagine it all depends on if there is a monetary judgment or just a cease and desist. But it does say that YTB reserves the right to default due to government actions. I think they are just covering their asses as they realize they are much closer to the fire.!
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone actually believe that any YTBite is actually going to consult a lawyer concerning this? Lawyers cost money. Just ask Coach.
ReplyDeleteWhat is a lawyer going to tell them anyway? Get out fast? There are those with unwavering allegiance to Coach that won't quit no matter what. They believe that Coach is going to turn it around and will stick it out.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
ReplyDeleteHey is this the same denyse from WHAM:
http://www.slideshare.net/denyse/ytb-travel-business-opportunity/
hell she even names the page business opportunity....
**********************************************
YES, it is the same Denyse. And do you see when it was posted??? 2 years ago!!
Thanks for advising me. I had forgotten about it. You'll probably see more things that were posted 2 years ago. Let me know. ;-)
Denyse - thanks for proving my point.
ReplyDeleteYTBers have been posting all sorts of stuff all over the internet that completely violate the new rules....
Its just creating a bigger mess because their members don't understand the rules, they rules are obviously not applied consistantly, and the rules are basically draconian....
What liability do they now open themselves up to because they don't enforce their own rules?
The SOT P & C Manual makes REPs just as independent as a hog on ice (Can't move about in a normal manner).
ReplyDeletePolicy 3.12
Overkill: Cancelling business to re-apply under new sponsorship
If you want to cancel your business and reapply under a new sponsor, for 4 months, you are not allowed to attend any YTBTN function to perform due diligent research of the market to find a sponsor that matches your desires.
It appears after 4 months, you may start doing due diligence research for a new sponsor.
So if you are in YTB you can't advertise YTB, blog about YTB, have YTB in your auto-signature or email address, use the YTB logo, or even have a blog that somehow refers people to YTB. And they may pay you, but they don't have to??
ReplyDeleteKate you are correct, and all that for $500 and $49.95 a month!
ReplyDeleteThe first rule of Fightclub(YTB) is you don't talk about YTB.....
ReplyDeleteIDIOTS!
ReplyDeleteI have never used the YTB name to promote MY site.
I have MY OWN travel store name and I use that name to promote my website. You people are nit picking IDIOTS. Cant you see how to bend the RULES after all the READING... of that new document. GHEEZE! and to think people give you credit for something. COME ON FOLKS. GET REAL!
this contract sure sounds like the IRS may decide RTAs are really employees ... that'll hit YTB hard in the wallet when they have to pay back employee payroll taxes and back social security payments.
ReplyDeleteyou only pay taxes on earnings.
ReplyDeleteI keep reading here that YTB reps and rta's dont make nothing. Make up your mind...
You people are really sad.
I still like to come here and have my daily laugh or two. Thanks for the chuckles you have provided me with this last year.
No, you hear that most earn very little. And let's not forget about unemployment taxes that also would be due.
ReplyDeleteBut the top pyramid guys are earning some big bucks and that indeed would be a tough nut to crack for a company that has $600K in cash and potentially $125M in lawsuit settlements.
And even for the vast majority who make next to nothing (138K X$39/yr for RTAs and 181K X $89 for the Reps) that equals a $22M salary or a minimum of a $3.1M tax bill
Now That's HOOT! That's what that is... A HOOT!
ReplyDeleteAre you forgetting the REPS and RTAS already pay tax thru a 1099 Misc income form. Is the IRS gonna refund all the tax collected to date thru 1099 forms?
I think not... YOUR A HOOT! Yall are getting desperate to stir up trouble. Yall a BUNCH of HOOTIN DRAMA QUEENS!
You BUNCH of HOOTS!
I appreciate you providing the CHUCKLES for me on this fine New Years Days...
HOOT! HOOT!
Melvin--they only issue 1099s to those that make more than $600 so there are not too many 1099s going out from Wood River. And you also assume that the few that receive them play by the rules. From what I have seen, they probably don't--deduct your kid's soccer uniform if you give a card out at a game ;)
ReplyDeleteBut the IRS woudl adjust it if it ever came down to it. I mean I imagine you are making millions right? Wouldn't it be a windfall for you to have them disallow your "business expenses" and then rebate 50% of the tax you paid and let YTB pick up the difference PLUS penalties?
I just listened to a phone call from a Director from Norfolk VA who made an outright claim that HIS director was making $400,000 per month just in residual income alone from YTB.