The Pinnacle Club is both an exclusive and elusive club for the top producers of Carnival Cruise Lines. Criteria for membership is a closely guarded secret akin to the Seven Society , the recipe for Coca Cola or even the herbs and spices in a leg of chicken from KFC.
Certainly sales play a part in the selection criteria and I would imagine future potential and creativity are also included as well.
Since there has been so much braggadocio from YTB over the years about how much Carnival they sold and how they were Pinnacle Club award recipients, I just assumed their numbers were off the board. So, I was surprised to see the addition of two new recipients announced this year:
Joystar with 4000 members, and Cruise Planners with 700 members received the award this year. Wow, talk about an accomplishment. These two entities achieved the same exalted status as YTB with 136,000 and 139,300 less members (respectively). Congrats to you both. Obviously this is a clear demonstration of your knowledge, expertise, and support of the cruise industry in general, and in particular of Carnival Cruise Lines. I wonder why it takes so many agents in YTB to achieve the same result?
I guess the more apt question might be, why was YTB not included in this award this year? Have their sales fallen? Have they not lived up to the potential Carnival expected? Did Carnival run out of the replica ships for the awards? Or is this another misunderstanding that is being worked out like the RCCL and IATAN issues?
Since Carnival does not officially release the recipient names, I also need to wonder if YTB did actually win it "three years in a row" as their many RTAs are fond of saying. I know when questioned at the Luxury Travel/Home Based Show in Vegas, Vicki Freed (then SVP at Carnival) said she only recalled them winning it one time. Is YTB becoming a "green" company and recycling awards? It is strange that in the photos of YTB winning it "three times" the Carnival BDM and Kim Sorenson are wearing the exact same clothes--all three years! Maybe someone from Carnival can set us straight.
I am not holding my breath. You see in the Seven Society, members are not known until after their death. I suspect it may be one or two more years till we hear.
Well, first of all you comment "I wonder why it takes so many agents in YTB to achieve the same result?" is ridiculous spin as it is the top award from Carnival. So, there isn't anything higher.
ReplyDeleteSecond, with your amazing internet search skills, you should be able to find (quicker than I did) links to news releases about YTB winning the award. In a matter of 30 seconds I found links (with pictures of Ann Sedgwick) by the way from 2005 and 2006 showing her presenting the award
Aww poor babies! I bet they did not get it because Carnival is busy re-defining an award bigger and greater than the Pinnacle Award just for them!
ReplyDeleteI never denied that YTB won the award. I said it appears they did not win it this year. Do you have any links to your information, please post them.
ReplyDeleteHey Anonymous, as John stated, those pictures with Ann Sedgwick in them.......in all of them that are from the supposed 3 years that YTB won this award, Ann and what's his face from YTB are wearing the same exact clothes. Appears to be a recycled picture. And considering that they are press releases from YTB, they are suspect, since YTB will issue a press release over anything, including everytime Coach passes gas. Let's see a picture of the 3 different awards all together.
ReplyDeleteI saw 2 separat pictures, one with the YTB guy wearing a bad Grey tie, and the other one he is wearing a blue blazer and he is up on stage with Ann Sedgewick at some event of some kind. I will go back and find the link.
ReplyDeleteNot only did YTB win it this year, they were the first travel company to win it this year.
ReplyDeleteRod said...
ReplyDeleteNot only did YTB win it this year, they were the first travel company to win it this year.
Boy, that's a rich statement, especially coming from the same person who made it a point to announce on another forum that "YTB is not Carnival's Favorite Travel Company" (and put it in bold letters!).
http://twcrossroadsdiscussionforum.yuku.com/topic/9685
Let me rephrase my last comment. YTB was the first travel company to win the Pinnacle Award in 2007.
ReplyDeleteBeing first with the most popular doesn't necessarily make you the most popular with the most popular cruise lines as another company won that prize.
The Pinnacle Awards are usually given in February to everyone. So what is so big about YTB being the "first"--maybe the other recipients were out selling travel and could not take the call and when it got to YTB they were doing the recruiting thing and of course the travel phone lines were open and they took the call.
ReplyDeleteOr maybe it is just more spin.
And Rod, the question still remains. Why does it take YTB 140,000 sales people to achieve the award when the other companies can do the same thing with far less people?
ReplyDeleteUmmm, dumbass because it is the highest award?!?!?!?!
ReplyDeleteSo, lets say the first 10 RTAs reached the award and 2 other companies with 10 people also reached the award. Then it doesn't matter if YTB has 139,990 others. Wow, are we stupid or what?
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteUmmm, dumbass because it is the highest award?!?!?!?!
So, lets say the first 10 RTAs reached the award and 2 other companies with 10 people also reached the award. Then it doesn't matter if YTB has 139,990 others. Wow, are we stupid or what?
Yeah, you must be stupid, because if you want to use ratios, then the other 2 companies reached the award with only 1 or 2 people to YTB's 10!
Uhm, are you really insinuating that it was 10 RTAs that sold enough travel to earn this award.
ReplyDeleteWOW, that is a BIG stretch
Man, you are a dumbass too. I was using small, round numbers so previous dumbass could compute. It was an EXAMPLE< that is why I said "lets just say..."
ReplyDeleteI expected YTB to be crowing about the Pinnacle Award like maniacs - which they are not - where's the press release - becasue they sold some ridiculous number of certificates last year?! I can't even remember the number - it seemed to change daily. Maybe certificates do not count as "cruises" as so many posted here?
ReplyDeleteAnonymous, I will reiterate my answer to you......if you want to use ratios, then the other 2 companies will have reached the same achievement with 1 or 2 people to YTB's 10, using your formula!
ReplyDeleteI wasn't using ratios...
ReplyDeleteneither was the initial comment.
Um, yeah you were. Maybe not intentionally, but you were. That's what taking 144,000 down to 10 is. Who's the dumbass now?
ReplyDeleteDon't try to discuss ratios with a YTBer. Remember, they can't even understant basic math!
ReplyDeleteNo, again...
ReplyDeleteHere is the initial comment.....
And Rod, the question still remains. Why does it take YTB 140,000 sales people to achieve the award when the other companies can do the same thing with far less people?
Not a ratio but a product of specific whole numbers. So, making a point that it was the highest award.....and IF it were acheived with X amount of people from YTB or 2 other agencies....then any number above X in sheer number of people would be immaterial to achieving the award.
Again, no ratios, very specific WHOLE numbers. This is basic math....I am in YTB and have no problem with it...so to answer your rhetorical question about "who's the dumbass now?" well.....YOU
So, how many YTBers does it take to win an award??
ReplyDeleteWHy is everyone fighting about the stupid ratios. YTB earned it and had a sales force of 140,000. Joystar earned it with 4,000. Cruise Planners earned it with 700.
ReplyDeleteIt is obvious that the level of support for CCL is greater with Joystar or Cruise Planners. The only reason YTB earned it was that there were 140,000 RTAs that likely bought their own cruise. Of course that woudl qualify them.
But when CCL sees the light, they realize that it is not really sales, but rebates on their product and not deserving.
It's obvious you're in YTB, because what you posted is a ratio problem, and you don't understand that.
ReplyDelete10 of 144,000 in YTB to achieve.
2 of 4000 in Joystar to achieve.
1 in 700 in Cruise Planners to achieve.
If you're going to say that it may be the top 10 in YTB that sold enough to achieve the award, then you have to reduce the same amount in the others to attain the same ratio. Now, the above is not exact, of course, but is a general idea. If a fraction of the YTB "agents" did the work, the the same fraction of agents has to be used in calculating with the other 2 agencies.
So, I guess in the long run, it really is you who is the dumbass. And speaking of that......why is it that when a YTBer is in a corner, they always have to come out with an insult?
Now, lets ask this question. If YTB won the award this year, where is their press release? As stated before, they're famous for releasing a press release on anything, even Coach passing gas. One would think that if they had achieved such a wonderful achievement, they would want the world to know. And don't say to pick up the phone and call headquarters. That answer is getting old, and all it means is that you don't know, so just say you don't know.
If this award is so important, why does Carnival not post it anywhere..why is it such a highly guarded secret? Wouldn't any company then be able to "say" they'd won the award for the last 3 years and no one would know..because the cruise line itself posts it no-where?
ReplyDeleteWhat does YTB winning an award have to do with..MLMs and Travel: A Bad Mix? Most of the topics of late have absolutely nothing to do with the theme of this blog. I would suggest renaming the blog to..MLMs and Travel: A Closer Look. How about it John?
ReplyDeleteThat might be a good suggestion....as to what this has to do with the topic...Carnival can give whatever it wants out to whomever it wants, but it gives a lot of people a VERY bad taste in their mouths when YTB or another MLM wins this because they are so unfocused on travel (for the most part).
ReplyDeleteIt is prostituting the industry. So therefore having them in the industry, is a bad mix
Common John, that's a bit of a spin, I mean a stretch.
ReplyDeleteJohn, "I guess the more apt question might be, why was YTB not included in this award this year?"
ReplyDeleteI know this question no doubt causes much anxiety amongst our traditional travel agent friends, but I say, relax..take it easy.
I saw Ann present the Pinnacle Award to YTB at last August's conference. Instead of getting all excited about this now, why don't we all wait and see what happens at this years conference? I'm not sure what the big deal is all about anyway.
olescorekeeper
ole, I think it's because it gets people all in a lather... ;-)
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty relaxed, though.
Good question...but if you google "YTB Pinnacle" there are over 10,000 pages of YTBites talking about it...so it MUST be important to some people...enough for them to get all a twitter about no?
ReplyDeleteAnon, twittering about is one thing, but being obsessed about why YTB has not received the award this year is another thing.
ReplyDeleteAnn's cool, relaxed. Good example.
olescorekeeper
This is wonderful. I am so glad I found your blog. I've just cancelled my subscription to "joke of the day" - just kidding. As a YTB RTA, I haven't sold anything - because I don't sell - I refer people to my sight and provide recommendations for travel. Oh, by the way, no one has booked a cruise through my sight either so you can count me out of the RTA number. That should lower the percentage for you. I've only had airlines, hotels, event tickets, and limos booked through my sight thus far. I don't care about the awards YTB gets either. You either want to book your travel through my sight or you don't. Let's not make this business harder than it is. I thank YTB for allowing me an avenue to make extra money and have a home based business. Keep up the good work John, you make me proud!
ReplyDeleteSD--the word is "site". One would think that since you have one, you would know how to spell it.
ReplyDeleteSo you are booking airline tickets and hotels through your site. How much are you making when you subtract the $449 entrance fee and the $49.95 a month and the other expenses you have incurred?
Okay, so I mispelled site by my brain crossing the slang "site" with the correct spelling of sight! I suppose you are the language arts teacher.
ReplyDeleteAnswer to your question - As a newer RTA (October 2007) my expenses are greater than my revenues. Last I checked, a local franchise owner also doesn't see a profit until about the 3rd year, although he/she invested thousands. It's not really comparable or you "mite" (might) like the term "apples to apples". Anyway - I made more on these bookings than I did a year ago when people went through Expedia, Orbitz, or Travelocity - it was $0.00 for me then. But I'll take an extra $25.00 here and there when I can get it. Thanks.
Hey, SD, I bet those "travel like an insider" come on's had nothing to do with you signing up with YTB either, did they?
ReplyDeleteYou can still be a home based agent, and refer people to a website by affiliating yourself with a reputable host agency, such as Joystar, for free, and make more in commission!
Well with three years in a franchise it is more expected because of the larger start up costs.
ReplyDeleteIf that is what you are expecting, you will have paid out $2298 in membership and hosting fees alone. That means you need to see $3800 in commission to YTB to break even in three years. You say you are about the airline tickets. That is almost 650 tickets one ticket every other day.
Good luck with that
Anonymous - are you implying YTB isn't reputable? I actually did look at a lot of the negative stuff on the web about YTB before signing up. I actually may have visited this blog, but I don't recall. And to be honest - a lot of the negative actually helped make my decision. It all appears to be so harsh and critical with envy or some jealous tendencies but it allowed me to ask questions that received answers I could accept.
ReplyDeleteSounds like a sound method of determining which business to go into to me....I don't think this blog was here back then---late October.
ReplyDeleteSD, I'm not implying anything. I'm outright stating that it is my opinion that YTB is not a reputable company. There are way too many people that don't make any money, yet those at the top keep getting wealthier and wealthier.
ReplyDeleteAnd no, you didn't visit this blog back when you were searching and making your decision. It didn't exist in October of 2007.
All I can say to you is that there are ways you can do what you're doing, for free and earn more commission, and do it with a company that has way more respect in the industry than YTB.
Thanks John, I am beginning to rely on you to provide me information I don't need to spend time on for myself. Let's not imply it's all about booking travel. The other side of the "plan" is to duplicate what I've done with others. We all know that the real money behind MLM travel is getting others to sign up and do the same. But I would never take what I am doing away from the true brick and mortar travel agencies and their well trained staffs. I just think it is logical to take advantage of travel commission portions going to me instead of some other internet booking site. And we also know there isn't much money, if any, in booking airlines, but more beneficial to book hotels, resorts, and cruises. Thanks
ReplyDeleteSD Martin . . . Welcome to YTB! You made a great choice to become an RTA. And a great choice to start a home business. Your home business tax savings alone are worth the price of admission. I'm sure you are like me: No desire whatsoever to become a "traditional" agent.
ReplyDeleteYour travel bookings will increase and, as long as you show pursuit of a profit and keep proper records, you will more than likely save a few thousand dollars a year in taxes. Good to hear you are building a Team. You will make money and develop some great friends.
The "traditionals" will never get YTB. We will move forward and just keep doing our thing. John, along with his anti-YTB throng, will continue to come up with ridiculous posts today's regarding the Carnival Pinnicle Award. And his anonymous throng will try to one-up each other as to how knowledgable they are about YTB.
If you haven't read the blog about YTB that slam dunks most of the anti-YTB yahoos, go to http://travel-pro.blogspot.com/
Doug does a great job of communicating the nuts and bolts of the YTB Business. It is, more times than not, a smackdown of the errant spaghetti that John throws against the wall about YTB.
You GET it . . . Good luck with your YTB Business.
A YTB Director (aka LBTRAVEL)
Thanks lbtravel, My most enjoyable experience thus far was when I told the desk clerk at a hotel in Chicago that I had a travel web site and was a "referring travel agent". I showed my credentials and business card. I politely inquired about any upgrades. Without hesitation - our 2 night stay went from a standard room to a $250.00 a night suite. You don't think I don't tell people to stay there? Best Western River North and free parking. Take care.
ReplyDeleteLB...are you Chris Paraldi the illegal gambling king pin? I know jon said he reads this blog.
ReplyDeleteGood reference to travel-pro.blogspot. Douggie used to do a half decent job, but now it seems he has retreated to the YTB method of calling names. Most of his posts now just seem to call names and offer nothign of substance--other than he likes Pittsberg.
Douggie is another in YTB that talks a good talk and makes ZERO money. The clown is not even a director which means he makes less than $20K a year
SD you keep on doing what you are douing, I am sure old coach is ready to make you a millionairre soon...just get in line behind the other quarter million reps that have earned nothign and are still waiting their turn
I hope you are not the same anonymous that corrected my spelling of "site" a while ago, because your language skills are awful! It says a lot about a person who doesn't identify themselves or speaks like Steve Martin reading a wet letter in the bathtub. (Sorry if you didn't see the movie "The Jerk" - rent it).
ReplyDeleteSD . . . Need I say more about the anonymous throng? This one was probably ytbscam with another of his many aliases.
ReplyDeleteHello SD Martin ditto's to what ibtravel said! And, a warm welcome to YTB from the olescorekeeper!
ReplyDeleteI noticed John, the blog's owner, did not welcome you to his blog. So, on behalf of John, welcome to the blog also!
John unwittingly created this blog to spew his anti-YTB rhetoric in hopes he will unite all the suppliers and traditional agents against this great company. But, it has surprisingly backfired on him. You will find that it's created more positive attention to this company and for that I thank John for. Like I have said before, John works for YTB for FREE in ways he will never understand.
If you want some real level-headedness discussions on YTB, go to Doug's blog. You will find him to be quite fair and balanced on any issue about YTB.
It's all good!!
olescorekeeper
lbtravel said...
ReplyDelete"SD . . . Need I say more about the anonymous throng? This one was probably ytbscam with another of his many aliases."
You took the words right out of my mouth lb. ;>)
olescorekeeper
Thanks olescorekeeper,
ReplyDeleteI have enjoyed the participation today and must move on. But I find it interesting that a person of self acclaimed stature, John, hasn't discovered the "Law of Attraction". The most powerful resource to success and fortune. It's basic truth is the more thoughts and feelings you have about something it will come to you. So if you hate YTB or MLM Travel for that matter - you shouldn't be giving it the time of day - because then it won't go away. Good night all.
sd martin,
ReplyDeleteI'm confused.
You signed up with YTB, you are loosing more money than you are making, and you're ok with that??
Why would you choose to loose money? I don't get it.
That's not a business. That's a hobby. Or something.
Well said SD! It's the Secret, the "Law of Attraction", but many will not discover it.
ReplyDeleteGood Night!
olescorekeeper
We're jealous? Of what? Let's compare what you have against what I have with my host.
ReplyDeleteYOU--$449 start up cost
ME--$100 start up cost
YOU--$49.95 monthly fee
ME--$20 monthly fee
YOU--a website to refer to
ME--a website to refer to
YOU--60% commission
ME--80% commission
YOU--No IATAN card or official industry recognition
ME--IATAN card within 4 months, and full industry recognition with all vendors.
YOU--pressure to recruit others so you might actually make something
ME--no pressure to do anything
Right out of the gate I'm better off than a YTBer, because my outlay is lower, and my monthly cost is half of an RTA's. Yeah, I'm REAL jealous.
Oh, and SD, Best Westerns everywhere have free parking, and that particular hotel touts it on it's webpage, so you didn't get anything special there. I'll bet you even got free internet access in your room, which is another standard feature of Best Western. And your $250 a night suite? Depending on the dates, I can get a suite at that particular hotel for less than that. So, again, you didn't get anything special.
I say we give YTB the Pinochle award for selling the most certificates in one day.
ReplyDeleteSD, The BW should have comped you that room. I'll send your post over to the GM and see if I can get you a refund. Shame how hotels take advantage of you poor RTAs.
And lookey, the stock has closed at a new low of $0.945! ROFLMAO
ReplyDeleteDLNWRulz said...
ReplyDelete"We're jealous? Of what? Let's compare what you have against what I have with my host."
olescorekeeper--Can I play?
YOU--$449 start up cost
ME--$100 start up cost
olescorekeeper--$449 one time, tax-deductible
YOU--$49.95 monthly fee
ME--$20 monthly fee
olescorekeeper--FREE!
YOU--a website to refer to
ME--a website to refer to
olescorekeeper--a better website to refer to
YOU--60% commission
ME--80% commission
olescorekeeper--60% commission with 10% overrides
YOU--No IATAN card or official industry recognition
ME--IATAN card within 4 months, and full industry recognition with all vendors.
olescorekeeper-- CLIA (IATAN doesn't put cash in my pocket. So no big deal.)
YOU--pressure to recruit others so you might actually make something
ME--no pressure to do anything
That's cuz your an order taker. Kinda like a McDonalds counter employee.
olescorekeeper--no pressure. Take it or leave it. "NEXT!"
"Right out of the gate I'm better off than a YTBer, because my outlay is lower,"
$399 lower? lol! Your quite the business thinker regarding a one-time fee.
"and my monthly cost is half of an RTA's. Yeah, I'm REAL jealous."
Naw, got you there pal, I pay $20 less, but who cares?
Oh..one more important detail you forgot to mention.
YOU--No leveraged income. No order taking, no commission's.
olescorekeeper--Leveraged income. Folks booking travel. Folks joining my business. All this, I might add, while snorkelling on my favorite cove in Maui! ;>)
olescorekeeper
Anybody want to clue John and the gang in that these Pinnacle Awards for Joystar and Cruise One are for 2007? Or is he trying to push that these two won the ward within the first month of 2008?
ReplyDeleteYTB first won the Pinnacle in April of 2005 when Ann Sedgwick came to the office.
YTB submitted a press release of our first award in May 2005
We won the Award again in 2006 and in 2007.
Carnival made the 2007 presentation first at the National Convention. And then again with Vicki Freed in Orlando back in October.
Based on our date being the beginning of March, it’s a little early to count YTB out of the mix just yet, especially with some 40,000 7 week equivalents booked for 2008 already. When YTB hits 100,000, we could top ‘em all.
Retractions and corrections three days in a row....
Sigh....
What makes you think my $100 wasn't tax deductible? My $100 was also 1 time, so ahead of you there.
ReplyDeleteYour monthly fee is only free, because you have others paying it for you. Why not do it yourself? With no downline, you would be paying the $49.95 a month.
You've never seen my website, so you don't know who's is better. Mine has all the same functionality as the generic one supplied by YTB, along with being personalized and being updated for me.
You only get those overrides of those beneath you sell anything. What happens if they don't? See, that 10% in overrides still only takes you up to 70%, and that is dependent on what others are doing. With my 80%, which is higher than 70, I'm dependent on no one but myself.
CLIA is not recognized industry wide, as the IATAN card is. You can only do so much (little) with a CLIA card. Try getting an AD75 with your favorite airline with a CLIA and YTB ID card. Not gonna happen. Try going on a FAM or getting reduced rates with many vendors (example...GOGO Tours) with your CLIA card and YTB ID. Again, not gonna happen.
I'm an order taker? How so? I have the same thing you do, a website that I can refer people to that want to book it themselves, but if they run into a snag, or want some personal attention, I'm available to them.
I work when I want. You are constantly on the prowl for people to recruit. And your leveraged income? Again, that brings up the poing that that income is dependent on what someone else is doing. I'm totally independent, and can make as much or as little as I want. I don't have to continually harangue others to get out and "sell, sell, sell". You always have to be on your toes, and ready with your spiel. Not moi. Ah, it sure feels good not to be dependent on others, and what they do.
What retractions and corrections are needed here, Doug? All you YTBers keep talking about 3 years in a row, 2005, 2006, and 2007. Well, you have given us the press releases for 2005 and 2007, but where is the one for 2006? No one seems to be able to find that one. Also, I was the person to whom Ms. Freed stated that she only recalled YTB winning once, and that was in front of 2 witnesses.
ReplyDeleteThe awards for this year were announced last month, yet we've heard nothing from YTB, a company known for putting out a press release at the drop of a hat.
Dougie--where were these retractions you claim? I saw one where he said he did not see a book button on his browser and he corrected it. Are you talking out your azz again?
ReplyDeleteJust go ahead and recycle the photo and tell everyone you won it again. Why is it that Vicky Freid said you only won it once. But then again she don't know squat right?
TravelPro said..."Anybody want to clue John and the gang in that these Pinnacle Awards for Joystar and Cruise One are for 2007?"
ReplyDeleteHey TravelPro, John, our gum shoe columnist did say,
"Joystar with 4000 members, and Cruise Planners with 700 members received the award this year.
Now, I've never known old John to jump to a conclusion, lie, fabricate, deliberately misinform or twist the facts. So, are you telling me he is..............? Well, I'm shocked!
olescorekeeper
They did receive the award this year, it was awarded in February, 2008. He didn't state for what year it was for.
ReplyDeleteAnother typical YTB tactic, trying to turn the tables!
This is all amusing to someone on the outside looking in. It is obvious there are many differences between the two "sides", so why not argue the points instead of attacking the individuals?
ReplyDeleteIf you agree or disagree with the blog entries, the blogger has not attacked people in the posts (yes, in comments in defense) as some other bloggers do.
It is kind of immature and really makes one wonder what type of business people (term used loosely) are involved with these programs.
Perhaps it might make sens to think before you type because most of you are coming off looking like dolts.
Oh for crying out loud. The darned award is given out in February of every year. It does not matter for which year it is for. YTB was not given an award with the most recent presentation/announcement.
ReplyDeleteCarnival keeps the award on the QT and does not make their own releases because it is a special award not available to most. That is understandable. They also leave it up to the individual recipients to publicize it if they want.
For all the YTB folks out there, call Ann Sedgewick and ask her. She will confirm it.
And just so you do not get your hopes up too high, YTB was also not named Agency of the Year. That went to AVC and there will be another Agency of the Year announced very shortly and again, this one is NOT YTB!
I just have a couple of comment's LNWRulz
ReplyDelete"What makes you think my $100 wasn't tax deductible?"
I never said or thought that it wasn't.
"My $100 was also 1 time, so ahead of you there."
Aw common now, ahead by a lousy $399? Is that really something to crow about? lol!
"Your monthly fee is only free, because you have others paying it for you."
"Others"? Who are these people? YTB bills the $49.95 and then credits it back.
"Why not do it yourself? With no downline, you would be paying the $49.95 a month."
Pay? What the heck for? But, I did pay the $49.95 for the first month I was in the business. That's the beauty of having a downline. I don't pay the $49.95 thanks to my downline and I'm leveraging my time. It really is great!
"You've never seen my website, so you don't know who's is better. Mine has all the same functionality as the generic one supplied by YTB, along with being personalized and being updated for me."
Except for several things. I have several options you don't have for your customers. YTB Flowers, Ticket's Now, Hunting & Fishing, Bridal Registry. This is becoming a big draw for wedding video and photographers. They are joining for this alone! How about YTB Golf? Can your customers coordinate their tee times with their travel reservations? Mine can! Your site may be nice, but YTB's is much better. No other travel sites can match this.
"You only get those overrides of those beneath you sell anything. What happens if they don't?"
Then I don't get the overrides. Some do, some don't, so what.
"See, that 10% in overrides still only takes you up to 70%, and that is dependent on what others are doing."
And that just fine with me.
"With my 80%, which is higher than 70, I'm dependent on no one but myself."
And I say, "good for you"!...sincerely.
"CLIA is not recognized industry wide, as the IATAN card is. You can only do so much (little) with a CLIA card. Try getting an AD75 with your favorite airline with a CLIA and YTB ID card. Not gonna happen. Try going on a FAM or getting reduced rates with many vendors (example...GOGO Tours) with your CLIA card and YTB ID. Again, not gonna happen."
Again, this doesn't concern me in the least. Even folks joining are not concerned. Like I said, CLIA, IATAN, and the perks don't put money in my pocket.
"I'm an order taker? How so? I have the same thing you do, a website that I can refer people to that want to book it themselves,"
Sorry. My misunderstanding. I thought you were a "order taker" like TravelLisa.
"I work when I want. You are constantly on the prowl for people to recruit. And your leveraged income? Again, that brings up the poing that that income is dependent on what someone else is doing. I'm totally independent, and can make as much or as little as I want. I don't have to continually harangue others to get out and "sell, sell, sell". You always have to be on your toes, and ready with your spiel. Not moi. Ah, it sure feels good not to be dependent on others, and what they do."
Oh grasshopper, but you are dependant on others. I think their called, "clients". I'm sure you "on your toes" for these folks.
Each to his own regarding leveraged income. You must be willing to come out of your comfort zone to do this. "Harangue"? No, not my stile. Like I told you earlier, I'm looking for people looking for me. I show them the business and they decide. The old saying applies...some will, some won't, who cares...NEXT!
Nice talking with you LNWRulz!
olescorekeeper
Right on, ole!
ReplyDeleteFirst of all, you really need to put your reading glasses on. The name is DLNWRulz, not LNW...
ReplyDeleteYou sure came across as if my $100 wasn't tax deductible, and that only monies used to invest into YTB were.
Yes, I'm ahead $399. That's $399 you don't have. That's $399 I can use for something else, something I enjoy, and not to line someone elses pocket!
Yes, you have 'others' paying your monthly fee. Those others are those in your downline. Like I said, if you didn't have your downline, you would be paying it. It may not be them directly, but someone is. The Tomer's aren't going to let anyone get by without paying their fees, by hook or by crook.
From my website, a client can certainly get show tickets, make tee times when booking a package, can book a fishing trip to Alaska or Mexico, etc. Do I have flowers or cars? No, I don't, because I have a TRAVEL site. I don't try and spread myself all over creation trying to make a dime. I concentrate on one thing, and do it well.
Ah, but having an IATAN card CAN put money in your pocket. It can save you money on airfare (a CLIA card can't), it can get you on FAM trips so that you become knowledgeable enough about a location to sell that location, etc. Think outside the box, Ole.
I am as dependent on clients, just as you are. And that is all I am dependent on. You, and every other person in YTB, is dependent on getting that downline and having that downline sell something, be it travel or more of those generic websites. And, like you say, you have to keep "looking" for people that are looking for you. You have to always be on the lookout for those people. I don't.
Am I "on my toes" for my clients? Depends on what you mean by that. If you mean am I willing to be of assistance to them if they need me, then yes, I am on my toes. If you mean that I have to be at their every beck and call, then no, I am not.
So, in your not so immortal word, Noscore......NEXT! I'm off to pack for a quick jaunt to S. Florida for the weekend, leaving tomorrow morning. If I have the time, I might grace you with my presence and wisdom so that you might actually learn something about the travel industry.
Ole,
ReplyDeleteNow see, I haven't said anything all day and you felt the need to throw my name in. While I may in your eyes be an "order taker", I actually love what I do, its not a hobby to me. I have respect for this industry. I make a very good salary, and I make my own hours. I work from home, and take care of my kids as well. So your "order-taker" comment, and comparing it to someone working at McDonalds is simply childish.
If I simply wanted to be a faceless website to sell travel on, I would make one. But then it would be boring to me. I prefer the interaction, I've met some nice people, have great clients and gotten backstage for many a concert because of my "order-taking". As for YTB's site being the be all end all..ummm you guys don't have the market on bridal registry...hell you weren't even the first. Alot of agencies do this and have for a while now. As with making tee times, limos and show tickets..This is nothing new.
TravelLisa said, "Alot of agencies do this and have for a while now. As with making tee times, limos and show tickets..This is nothing new."
ReplyDeleteSorry TravelLisa, Fran, I was yawning all through your repetitive blabber thinking, "nothing fresh and original from TL". Well, funny, you summed it up for me in your last sentence. ;>) Can't stop laughing!
olescorekeeper
Leverage, leverage, leverage. The "traditionals" will never get this part. That's why their whole argument is apples and oranges.
ReplyDeleteThere is only one DLNWRulz and one travellisa. Leverage, residuals, profit-sharing. Kind of a nice trifecta.
Yawn. Sorry Ole, I mean mini-Tom, And the same childish banter from you.
ReplyDeleteLB your kidding right. I work for the #2 agency worldwide. Leverage..got it. Profit sharing..got it. Overrides..got it. No costs each month, no having to recruit, work from home, got the tax write offs, I actually SELL TRAVEL, and I have IATAN, CLIA. I can also sell RCCL and the other vendors YTB cannot. Which the group of 50 I got today for RCCL worked nicely.
ReplyDeletetravellisa: Please explain your leverage and overrides. And don't give me the "leverage" you have working with a big agency. I'm talking about getting paid on the efforts of others. Yes, I have leverage with Lexus automobiles because I have a brother-in-law that sells Lexus automobiles. Sorry, that doesn't count.
ReplyDelete"Leverage: I'm talking about getting paid on the efforts of others."
ReplyDeleteI own my own travel agency. I have Independent Contractors/agents who book their travel thru my agency. For that privilege, they earn 75% of the total commission, I keep 25%.
Host agency = leverage.
John said...
ReplyDeleteOh for crying out loud. The darned award is given out in February of every year. It does not matter for which year it is for. YTB was not given an award with the most recent presentation/announcement.
In February every year? Since when?
Cruise One got on in May 2005
Here’s one for Interval Travel in June 2006
Here’s one for Affordabletours.com in March 2005
And we have pictures of Scott and Kim being handed one in August 2007
February?!
Cry all you want...
OK Doug--you are right, everything I have said is a lie and you have proven me wrong on every post since October. Feel free to go ahead and put it in your blog how you proved me wrong once again. That will make your downline happy and might even propel you to that elusive Level 1 Directorship.
ReplyDeleteI was told by an executive at CCL that it is an award determined in February. I will be sure to tell him that Doug says he is a liar. Since CCL does not publicize the award, might it make sense that the recipients might like to publicize it when it best fit's their needs? Like maybe when there are a few thousand RTAs at an annual convention?
"I will be sure to tell him that Doug says he is a liar" . . .
ReplyDeleteReal classy, John.
SD Martin said, "Okay, so I mispelled site by my brain crossing the slang "site" with the correct spelling of sight!"
ReplyDeleteDictionary.com says, "site /saɪt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[sahyt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, verb, sit·ed, sit·ing.
–noun 1. the position or location of a town, building, etc., esp. as to its environment: the site of our summer cabin.
2. the area or exact plot of ground on which anything is, has been, or is to be located: the site of ancient Troy.
3. Computers. Web site."
and
"sight /saɪt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[sahyt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun 1. the power or faculty of seeing; perception of objects by use of the eyes; vision.
2. an act, fact, or instance of seeing.
3. one's range of vision on some specific occasion: Land is in sight.
4. a view; glimpse.
5. mental perception or regard; judgment.
6. something seen or worth seeing; spectacle: the sights of London."
plus a lot more to both definitions.
I don't see any mention of slang. So don't get so uppity when someone correct your error. Check your facts first.
If you would like to deflect this to Vicki or any other Executive at Carnival go right ahead. Carnival is not the one spewing lies, and sticking their head in the sand.
ReplyDeleteYour quote:
It is strange that in the photos of YTB winning it "three times" the Carnival BDM and Kim Sorenson are wearing the exact same clothes--all three years! Maybe someone from Carnival can set us straight.
Here is a photo taken April of 2005 with Ann Sedgwick and Kim
Here are numerous photos taken at the 2007 presentation at the National Convention
Exact same cloths?
John…the problem isn’t Carnival. The problem isn’t YTB.
The problem is you.
Three days in a row buddy…
PS - You need to download this Song.
Douggie--so are you saying that you DID win the award? I know with all your years of experience in the business you probably have the inside scoop--so did YTB win it again? Inquiring minds want to know? Or is this typical YTB tactics--when confronted with something you cannot dispute call people names and deflect?
ReplyDeleteYTB was given the Pinnacle Award in late April 2005
ReplyDeleteAgain in May of 2006
Again in August of 2007
It’s March 6th of 2008.
Give it some time Anon. There are another 10 full months in 2008. ;-P
Here's from the latest "Cruise Week" and their discussion of Carnival's pinnacle awards and agency of the year awards.
ReplyDelete"As For Cruises and MLMs....
One model conspicuously absent from the awards picture is the multilevel
marketing organizations (or card mills, as their detractors call them)..."
waaa waa waaa it can't be we have to be chosen...waaa waaaa waaaa kick kick ....i am holdingf my breath till you give me the award...waaa waaaa waaa....but Coach said we got it...waaaa waaaa waaa ...this is not fair...waaaa waaaa....you are wrong....you lie....waaa waaaa....we sold certificates in November.....waaa waaaa....we took a Birthday Bash....waaaa waaaa waaa
ReplyDeleteJohn said Mar 5, 2008 10:45:00 AM, "WHy is everyone fighting about the stupid ratios. YTB earned it and had a sales force of 140,000. Joystar earned it with 4,000. Cruise Planners earned it with 700.
ReplyDeleteIt is obvious that the level of support for CCL is greater with Joystar or Cruise Planners. The only reason YTB earned it was that there were 140,000 RTAs that likely bought their own cruise. Of course that woudl qualify them.
But when CCL sees the light, they realize that it is not really sales, but rebates on their product and not deserving."
1) There were only 110,000 RTAs last August when YTB was presented with the Award.
2) Looking at the YTB Group Cruise Booking website tells a different story that cruise sales is not from rebating:
https://www.ytbtravel.com/grouptravel/main.aspx?YTBID=YTB41138
Rod--as Doug is so fond of saying they don;t mean anything till the commission is in hand.
ReplyDeleteAnyone can book a group and offer discounted pricing to the public. But how many of those groups actually materialize?
Have you ever listed a group on that page? Have you ever sold a group and completed it?
Most of those groups will fall apart.
Most groups fall apart! Also, if you look at the group list the vast majority are for 3, 4 and sometimes 5 night cruises. I know my feelings on a 3- or 4-night group cruise, it's usually more work than the small amount of commission that will be received.
ReplyDeleteLB
ReplyDeleteI do not want that type of leverage. If it means soliciting other people to join a company where majority make no money, losing friends, family, collegues in the process to make a few extra dollars a month. No thanks. I prefer to actually earn my money.
The leverage I prefer is working for a well known company that has massive buying/negotiating power to get me the best possible price/commission so I can earn the most on each TRAVEL BOOKING I make.
Of course Rod hasn't ever listed a group on the YTB pages. Rod doesn't sell anything, or at least anything that earns him any return on his investments!
ReplyDelete"If it means soliciting other people to join a company where majority make no money, losing friends, family, collegues in the process to make a few extra dollars a month. No thanks. I prefer to actually earn my money"
ReplyDeleteTravellisa may or may not make a lot of money with her "leveraged" traditional TA position. She says she does, but anyone can type on a blog. One thing she does know how to do: She has the anti-MLM talking points down pat.
AVC just released a recent press release that they also got the CCL Pinnacle Award AND were named Agency of the Year by CCL ... AVC has a lot fewer affiliates that YTB has RTAs, and I'd bet that they have fewer than Joystar and Cruise Planners.
ReplyDeleteIt does appear that CCL is (or has) handed out the 2008 awards ... so if YTB didn't get one, ya think they'll be getting one later in the year????
Here is the CCL release on the two agencies of the year...
ReplyDeleteAMERICA’S VACATION CENTER AND THE CRUISE LINE LTD
NAMED ‘AGENCIES OF THE YEAR’ FOR CARNIVAL CRUISE LINES
MIAMI (March 6, 2008) – America’s Vacation Center and The Cruise Line Ltd. have been selected as Carnival Cruise Lines’ “travel agencies of the year” for 2007.
These two agencies were selected from among more than 30,000 cruise-selling travel agencies throughout the U.S. and Canada. Travel agencies that demonstrate exceptional professionalism, enthusiasm and innovation in sales and marketing techniques are nominated based on feedback from Carnival’s business development managers who are based throughout North America and work in partnership with travel agents.
Carnival’s Senior Vice President of Sales and Guest Services Lynn C. Torrent noted the two award recipients have each achieved a high level of success by employing distinctly different business models. While each has developed a national network of home-based agents, America’s Vacation Center focuses on developing a worldwide network of home-based independently owned and operated affiliates, while The Cruise Line Ltd. takes a more traditional agency approach by encouraging local agents to concentrate on their local communities from virtual home-based offices.
“Regardless of their chosen business model, these two agencies share a common platform of providing superior customer service with extensive knowledge of the wide-ranging cruise styles and amenities available to consumers -- which is key to any successful travel agency,” Torrent said. “America’s Vacation Center and The Cruise Line Ltd. clearly demonstrate that there is more than one way to attract and retain clients in today’s competitive marketplace,” she added.
America’s Vacation Center has an intense focus on the overall customer experience and has re-invented itself over the past few years, particularly after Sept. 11, by offering travelers the service of specialized, home-based travel professionals who act as Personal Vacation Planners.
A family-owned business, America’s Vacation Center is one of the largest and fastest-growing travel companies in North America and beyond, and is deeply committed to personal, friendly service for travelers worldwide. Providing the best value, service, personal accountability, and more, America’s Vacation Center’s long-lasting relationship with American Express, elite network of experienced Personal Vacation Planners, patent-pending proprietary software, and unrivaled reputation have catapulted them to the forefront of the travel industry.
“We are incredibly honored and humbled to be named Carnival Cruise Lines' 'Agency of the Year' for 2007, and we are elated that our preferred suppliers like Carnival are thrilled with our unique travel agency model and approach to providing exceptional customer service," said Van Anderson, co-president of America’s Vacation Center.
The Cruise Line Ltd. (www.lowcruiseprices.com) was established in 2000 and, over the past eight years, has grown from a niche player into a true innovator in the cruise industry, particularly in the area of travel agent training and development.
The Cruise Line Ltd. is a full service travel agency specializing in private group trips and custom itineraries for individuals, through its passion for travel and attention to detail, makes booking cruise vacations affordable, easy and fun.
In addition to a staff based at its North Potomac, Md., headquarters, The Cruise Line Ltd. maintains virtual offices across the nation for its agents and has pioneered such initiatives as the “Cruise Moms,” (www.CruiseMoms.com) designed to provide stay-at-home parents with a “turnkey approach” for working from home on either a full- or part-time basis. With such programs, its in-depth training mini-courses and training manual, along with its upcoming web-casts, it anticipates maintaining its position as a leader in the industry.
Mark Jacobs, CEO and President of The Cruise Line Ltd, said: “When the world’s largest cruise line names you as its ‘Agency of the Year,’ it speaks volumes to the hard work and dedication of our sales force and customer service department who truly deserve the award and the credit. Our agency receiving this recognition is truly gratifying since it is, after all, the clients who enable our business to be in this honored position today.”
The staffs of America’s Vacation Center and The Cruise Line, Ltd. and Carnival executives will travel via limousine to a restaurant of their choice. As a permanent reminder of their achievement, each agency will receive an exquisite cherry and maple grandfather clock to display in their offices.
###
Carnival Cruise Lines, a unit of Carnival Corporation & plc (NYSE/LSE: CCL; NYSE: CUK), is a proud member of the exclusive World’s Leading Cruise Lines. Our exclusive alliance also includes Holland America Line, Princess Cruises, Cunard Line, Costa Cruises, and The Yachts of Seabourn. Sharing a passion to please each guest, and a commitment to quality and value, our member lines appeal to a wide range of lifestyles and budgets. Together, we offer exciting and enriching cruise vacations to the world’s most desirable destinations.
I ended another rumor ended today which was started on 3/5/08 by jwf. This reminds me of the reason I began my daily viewing of this blog. I found that a lot of rumors were started and I wanted to help clear things up. Well, I see I am still needed.
ReplyDeletejwf said, "The Pinnacle Agencies were named in early February and YTB was not one of them. When you won it last year, it was "won" in February but they waited till the convention to make a presentation. But trust me, I know it is not happening this year."
So, on 3/7/08 I e-mailed YTB's contact at Carnival Cruise Lines, Business Development Director, Ann Sedgwick, and asked her "Ann, have all agencies been named that are going to receive a Carnival Cruise Lines Pinnacle Award in 2008?"
Here's Ann's reply: "Hi Rodney,
YTB was presented with Carnival's Pinnacle Award for the years 2005, 2006 and 2007. (The awards that were presented in February 2008 were for 2007) .
We gave YTB their award in October 2007, presented by Vicki Freed. We actually gave it a little earlier than normal because of the FUNSHINE event in Orlando and so many RTA's in attendance. Normally, it would not have been presented until February.
Thanks,
Ann
jwf said, Since Carnival does not officially release the recipient names, I also need to wonder if YTB did actually win it "three years."
Now you know.
Doug already proved the ass wrong Rodney but thanks for following up for all of us RTAs. Now if whoever this Vicki Freed is woudl only come clean and admit that she lied to the agent at the trade show by telling him we only won it once.
ReplyDeletehappy new,
ReplyDeleteWe all know who Vicki Freed is.
John said, "I know when questioned at the Luxury Travel/Home Based Show in Vegas, Vicki Freed (then SVP at Carnival) said she only recalled them winning it one time."
Key words -- "I know". John, if you only knew what you don't know.
We don't know who told John that Vicki Freed said "I can only recall YTB receiving the award once."
Does John expect us to believe that Vicki Freed doesn't know the one and only travel company to ever have received the Carnival Pinnacle Award 3 years in a row?
Saying that Vicki Freed doesn't recall the only travel company to ever have received the Carnival Pinnacle Award 3 years in a row is about as big an insult you can give to Vicki.
I was not there but the person that asked her is a trusted friend. SO I will take him at his word.
ReplyDeleteJohn that is just too far fetched for me to believe. Vicki and Ann Sedgwick presented the award to Kim Sorenson on stage at the YTB 2007 National Convention in August 2007. It was clearly known that is the 3rd time YTB received the award. No way Vicki did not know YTB received the award 3 years straight. Tell your trusted friend no way I believe him.
ReplyDelete